S650 Coyote V8: Differences in GT vs Dark Horse

[Schwerin]

He also says it has forged pistons, and Ford doesn't mention that anywhere. Doesn't sound like he is correct.

If you go by Ed Krenz's quote, the only changes are the forged rods. Which is why I am hoping for a higher redline.

To be fair no one knew the performance package on the Taurus SHO had upgraded internals that the police interceptor got until people started to tear the engines down and were like "wait why are these two motors different?"

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[Dub347sbf]

To be fair no one knew the performance package on the Taurus SHO had upgraded internals that the police interceptor got until people started to tear the engines down and were like "wait why are these two motors different?"

“On this program, the engines are far more common between the GT and the Dark Horse. Literally, the only difference at the end of the day is we ported over the forged connecting rods from the Predator engine.”

That is a quote from Ed Krenz, chief nameplate engineer for the Mustang. Now, they may be hiding something, sure. I really started the thread to see if I missed an article about there being more differences. I suppose we will have to wait and find out.

 

[because_murica]

To be fair no one knew the performance package on the Taurus SHO had upgraded internals that the police interceptor got until people started to tear the engines down and were like "wait why are these two motors different?"

I don't think the Taurus, especially the SHO, got a fair shake. I'd love a modern SHO.

 

[Gogoggansgo]

That is a quote from Ed Krenz, chief nameplate engineer for the Mustang. Now, they may be hiding something, sure. I really started the thread to see if I missed an article about there being more differences. I suppose we will have to wait and find out.

they’re definitely hiding something we don’t even have a pic under the hood of a dark horse

what i find odd is if it’s just better cams, why not do more, larger throttle bodies, different intake. We are definitely missing something

 

[Schwerin]

I don't think the Taurus, especially the SHO, got a fair shake. I'd love a modern SHO.

I still believe the Fusion Sport should have been called Fusion SHO and that an updated Taurus SHO should have gotten a tuned version of the 400HP/400TQ 3.0T with closer to 450hp. Using the 3.0T in ONLY the MKZ made it a total sleeper NO ONE expects and super few knew about. Its not even got any real logo to notice that stands out from the 2.0T, just a 2 replaced with a 3 on the trunk. Heck that engine is STILL the basis for the Raptors today.

Look around. AWD 350-400HP is STILL the standard for luxury sedans. And the SHO was what? 12yrs ago?

 

[9secondko]

Don’t kid yourself upgraded cams could give the dark house a solid 20-30hp alone especially if they focus on valve timing to a key. Point being i wouldn’t be surprised if the dark horse hits 525hp

mid it has different cams, that’s massive. Not going to swap upgraded cams if it isn’t for a major boost.

if true, the Dark Horse will be an NA beast.
Add the better suspension and it may be a new favorite.

perhaps even worthy of the Boss name.

but I suspect the Boss is still a thing for the s650 generation, but it may have a larger engine. We already had the Boss 302 remix…

the Dark Horse seems more like a Mach 1 with a power and handling package.

noce to have right out of the gate to launch a new generation, but still think it should have been the NEW GT.

The cams really have me thinking. This thing can be at 525-530 hp or more with torque to go with it - the one thing the GT350 lacked.

I’d prefer a heritage nameplate, but if this is what it takes to get Ford engineers and designers to embrace serious modern sports car performance, I’m all for it.

 

[OppoLock]

I thought I saw a photo showing 7500 rpm redline in one, however, I do not recall where I saw the photo or if it was from a video. Will report back if I happen upon it again with a link.

I saw it too. It was a rendering of the dark horse interior, not a real photo. The redline is way off.

https://ibb.co/HgVGtgt

https://ibb.co/p4DdBGM

Btw these photos, especially the second, are massive. Just be aware if you right-click -> open them in a separate tab. If you blow up the second image to full res you can see that they just overlaid a generic set of images into the bezels (also why the screens look so nice and pushed to the edge of the bezels) because the image clips through the bottom right of the main screen.

 

[Stonehauler]

I still believe the Fusion Sport should have been called Fusion SHO and that an updated Taurus SHO should have gotten a tuned version of the 400HP/400TQ 3.0T with closer to 450hp. Using the 3.0T in ONLY the MKZ made it a total sleeper NO ONE expects and super few knew about. Its not even got any real logo to notice that stands out from the 2.0T, just a 2 replaced with a 3 on the trunk. Heck that engine is STILL the basis for the Raptors today.

Look around. AWD 350-400HP is STILL the standard for luxury sedans. And the SHO was what? 12yrs ago?

don't know what you are seeing, but top end luxury performance sedans are in the upper 400s to almost 700 Yes, I know, they are much more expensive than the SHO was, but with the SHO, I would have expected upper 400s by now.

 

[Schwerin]

don't know what you are seeing, but top end luxury performance sedans are in the upper 400s to almost 700 Yes, I know, they are much more expensive than the SHO was, but with the SHO, I would have expected upper 400s by now.

Who said top end? I said " standard for luxury sedans"
TLS type-S 350
Q50 300 and 400hp options
BMW 3/4 series 382
Genesis 300-375
MB you have to get to an upper E-Class to get over 300.

All of those are more than a SHO, but dont even have the power of a 2017 3.0T MKZ(MKz has 50tq more than the 400HP Q50).

 

[Stonehauler]

Who said top end? I said " standard for luxury sedans"
TLS type-S 350
Q50 300 and 400hp options
BMW 3/4 series 382
Genesis 300-375
MB you have to get to an upper E-Class to get over 300.

All of those are more than a SHO, but dont even have the power of a 2017 3.0T MKZ(MKz has 50tq more than the 400HP Q50).

Taurus size is more to the 5 series than 3/4 size. I know, as I was cross shopping those two (plus the Lincoln). Today's m550 is 536 hp beast. Chevy SS was 415 hp..and as you said, this was years ago. Today's Charger Scat Pack is 485. So based on that, I would expect minimum 425-430 hp from a SHO today. Remember, the SHO was supposed to be a performance car. Too bad it had so much torque steer in it as that's the reason I passed on it.

 

[Marty1000]

Great DH review by Motor Trend's Kristen Lee.



Bottom line she loves the car and is not crazy about touch screen controls for the climate.

 

[Paul's stable]

Rods and cams are a bigger difference than a manifold that could be called "comparable" and an intake tube.

Also, the Boss had pistons, rods, compression ratio, camshafts, valve springs, crankshaft-sensor trigger-wheel and manifold over a normal GT. There was a reason the BOSS engine was given its own name, Roadrunner, and the Mach1 and, so far, the DH doesnt.

Dark Horse has many differences to the GT engine is a lot. That's why they now sell a Dark Horse crate engine separate to the 5.0 crate engine.

 

[Frogdog1]

I find it interesting that Ford has an advertised 420hp Coyote, then a 460hp engine, then a 480hp engine, then a 500hp Coyote. Nice round numbers aren't they? Makes me think marketing plays a large role in stated HP. I have to wonder what the real HP of these engines are.

They sure do advertise nice round numbers. Reality doesn't work that way. Sounds like a marketing dept. said: make the next engine "this or that nice, round number". Again, I doubt that's what the real HP's are. It doesn't really matter because we bought the cars.

 

[robvas]

They rate them using SAE J whatever the spec is

But they can control the numbers using the computer

that 420 engine becomes 435 with a tune

 

[Germansheperd]

They rate them using SAE J whatever the spec is

But they can control the numbers using the computer

that 420 engine becomes 435 with a tune

A tune CAN do that but…… the 420 to 435 was an upgraded head with bigger valves, upgraded cams, and a compression change.
‘One can then say that 435 become 460 and so on.

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