Will you be ordering a manual or auto?

[detamble13]

That makes no sense. Transmission is a personal preference that has nothing to do with being an enthusiast. I've had both and they both have their pros and cons.
Camaro's are horrible looking and horrible to drive imo. I would never ever own a modern Camaro unless they changed, well everything with the body and interior.

Just because we are enthusiasts does not mean we need to choose or prefer manual transmission. I chose the tremec, but some people may not like to row their own gears, or may not be able to get one where they live. It asks what we will be ordering, not what we want or prefer.

You guys are dismissing the value a manual transmission adds to the driving experience. If you drag race an auto makes sense. If you're physically incapable of operating a clutch pedal an auto makes sense. Otherwise you've chosen the auto due to laziness which most definitely means less enthusiastic.

It's nice to have options for sure but as more people have chosen automatics the availability of manuals has diminished. Especially in cars that have traditionally offered them ie. Corvette and now you have to step up to a V8 in the Mustang to get one. One way to ensure not all cars become driverless is to be an advocate for manual transmissions. We're all on here because we enjoy driving right?

I like the Mustang. If I need to replace my Camaro and the only car left in the segment is a Mustang I'd probably buy one. To say the Camaro needs everything to change for your consideration as a purchase is pure fanboy. Alpha is regarded as one of the best platforms and also underpins some of the best sports sedans currently on sale now in the Cadillac CT4 and CT5. 1LE is regarded as superior to the Mach 1 without having to go through the PP1 and 2 stages. You get a Tremec 6 speed manual when you step up to the V8 and don't need a higher trim level. You don't have to like the competition but you should respect it if it's deserving. I respect the Mustang because without it there would be no Camaro.

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[shogun32]

Otherwise you've chosen the auto due to laziness which most definitely means less enthusiastic.

just to play devil's advocate, what was the rationale behind the Camaro SS/1LE being sullied with the A10 option after 2 years then? Sure GM's A10 is considerably better tuned than Ford's...

Its because Drivers are all but extinct and since they haven't taught stick in driving schools for 30+ years there is a very large contingent of people who have never experienced it and thus ignorant of the joy. And since the automotive so-called "press" mindlessly parrots the manufacturer's preferred narrative of automatics are faster and easier, there is no motivation to leave the warm embrace of automatic safe-space.

I was dumbfounded the Germans who drive Porsches bought into the DSG and didn't demand a stick. It was us American Neanderthals that forced Porsche to offer it. Oh how far have the mighty have fallen. Pity the same message didn't get thru to Audi. I have the last year of V8+6MT Audi and it's a total blast. It's a crime they don't offer the RS3 and S5 with a stick, even if the motors are all twin-turbo.

 

[NegativeMultiplier]

Tremec for me. If for some reason a DH is off the table, MT-82.

I've got a hunch the new MT-82 is going to be better than last gen. It only makes sense if Ford's trying to send this car out with a bang.

 

[ChitownStang]

You guys are dismissing the value a manual transmission adds to the driving experience. If you drag race an auto makes sense. If you're physically incapable of operating a clutch pedal an auto makes sense. Otherwise you've chosen the auto due to laziness which most definitely means less enthusiastic.

It's nice to have options for sure but as more people have chosen automatics the availability of manuals has diminished. Especially in cars that have traditionally offered them ie. Corvette and now you have to step up to a V8 in the Mustang to get one. One way to ensure not all cars become driverless is to be an advocate for manual transmissions. We're all on here because we enjoy driving right?

I like the Mustang. If I need to replace my Camaro and the only car left in the segment is a Mustang I'd probably buy one. To say the Camaro needs everything to change for your consideration as a purchase is pure fanboy. Alpha is regarded as one of the best platforms and also underpins some of the best sports sedans currently on sale now in the Cadillac CT4 and CT5. 1LE is regarded as superior to the Mach 1 without having to go through the PP1 and 2 stages. You get a Tremec 6 speed manual when you step up to the V8 and don't need a higher trim level. You don't have to like the competition but you should respect it if it's deserving. I respect the Mustang because without it there would be no Camaro.

The Camaro is being discontinued again because nobody wants it. Thats also why it's cheaper. The Mach 1 is a better car than a 1LE in every way except maybe a a little time on a track driven by a professional at the cars limits, not really something I experience....lol
again, My last Mustang was a manual, loved it, even miss it sometimes but wanted something different this time. Having a choice is great.

 

[Marty1000]

Manual - Tranny = lower insurance costs!

 

[EFI]

You guys are dismissing the value a manual transmission adds to the driving experience.

I don't think you fully understand the definition of "personal preference". I personally don't get any better driving experience with the manual, so why would I choose it?

I enjoy driving the car left, right and straight and get no pleasure out of manually shifting gears. I prefer the connected feeling of having both hands on the steering wheel when going around the track and consider clutching in and manually shifting an unnecessary chore.

And I can assure you I'm just as much an enthusiast as anyone else on this forum. You dismissing someone's enthusiasm for the car we all love purely out of their own personal choice means you're more likely the less enthusiast.

However, to me it sounds like you're more butthurt because you're a Camaro owner on a Mustang website and don't like the fact that guys on here prefer the Mustang and have negative connotations towards the Camaro you drive. If the 1LE was so superior to the Mach, surely it would post better times. Given even the "lowly" PP2 is faster on track, I don't think you have much basis to talk crap about the superior Mach.

 

[detamble13]

just to play devil's advocate, what was the rationale behind the Camaro SS/1LE being sullied with the A10 option after 2 years then? Sure GM's A10 is considerably better tuned than Ford's...

Its because Drivers are all but extinct and since they haven't taught stick in driving schools for 30+ years there is a very large contingent of people who have never experienced it and thus ignorant of the joy. And since the automotive so-called "press" mindlessly parrots the manufacturer's preferred narrative of automatics are faster and easier, there is no motivation to leave the warm embrace of automatic safe-space.

I assume the auto was offered in the 1LE to promote higher sales. I think you're right in terms of people not having experienced the joy of driving a manual. I learned on a Ford Escort and while the car was horrible the manual made it fun.
The automotive press briefly questioned the lack of a manual in the C8 but I do wish they would bring it up more often. A Z06 with a manual would be great. The article below gives me hope but with the impending electric onslaught I can't see myself being interested in new car news in the future. "automatic safe space" haha
https://www.roadandtrack.com/reviews/a42812466/cadillac-ct5-v-blackwing/

The Camaro is being discontinued again because nobody wants it. Thats also why it's cheaper. The Mach 1 is a better car than a 1LE in every way except maybe a a little time on a track driven by a professional at the cars limits, not really something I experience....lol
again, My last Mustang was a manual, loved it, even miss it sometimes but wanted something different this time. Having a choice is great.

The Camaro may be discontinued at some point but there hasn't been anything announced officially. It's assembled on the same line as the CT4 and CT5 Cadillacs and it's production numbers are significant to the operation of Lansing Grand River as those are the only three vehicles assembled there. The LT1 is maybe less expensive than a GT but it was designed that way to get into a V8 at a lower cost. You still get the Tremec.

Having a choice is nice but it's been headed towards all automatic for a while and if no one advocates for the manual we'll have less choice.

I don't think you fully understand the definition of "personal preference". I personally don't get any better driving experience with the manual, so why would I choose it?

I enjoy driving the car left, right and straight and get no pleasure out of manually shifting gears. I prefer the connected feeling of having both hands on the steering wheel when going around the track and consider clutching in and manually shifting an unnecessary chore.

And I can assure you I'm just as much an enthusiast as anyone else on this forum. You dismissing someone's enthusiasm for the car we all love purely out of their own personal choice means you're more likely the less enthusiast.

However, to me it sounds like you're more butthurt because you're a Camaro owner on a Mustang website and don't like the fact that guys on here prefer the Mustang and have negative connotations towards the Camaro you drive. If the 1LE was so superior to the Mach, surely it would post better times. Given even the "lowly" PP2 is faster on track, I don't think you have much basis to talk crap about the superior Mach.

Have you ever driven a manual?

My bum does not hurt. I like this forum and Camaro5/6 as well and enjoy the banter that takes place. I'm good with you guys liking the Mustang and when the 2013 ZL1 came out with 580hp and Ford came out the next day with their 660hp (I think) GT500 I thought it was a great move. GM actually released a statement acknowledging the competition.

If the Mach 1 was the final iteration of a track focused 5 liter, does PP stand for prepubescent 1 and 2?

 

[kz]

connotations towards the Camaro you drive. If the 1LE was so superior to the Mach, surely it would post better times. Given even the "lowly" PP2 is faster on track, I don't think you have much basis to talk crap about the superior Mach.

PP2 faster on track ?

Hahahahahaha

Are you serious ? Have you driven 1/LE ? It's quite a bit better than PP2 (which was an extremely lame attempt from Ford) and around where Mach 1 with handling package is. And I say this as 100% Mustang person having driven 1/LE. Don't bench race with some times off internet, go drive one on track.

 

[EFI]

Don't bench race with some times off internet, go drive one on track.

But that's the only true way to compare 2 different cars, especially stock. Me driving an unfamiliar car on track is not going to tell much on how it compares to mine unless I get similar seat time with it to really get comfortable. And all that's going to tell me is how it compares to mine as it sits right now, which is far from what a stock PP2 is capable of and something I've never driven.

So unfortunately all I can go with is performance numbers of the interwebz.

 

[shogun32]

So unfortunately all I can go with is performance numbers of the interwebz.

good point but again lap times is worthless to convey the goodness of the car. Eg. the C7 may set a good time but drives evil, and anyone who doesn't know how to drive a C7 is likely to end up spun out in the grass or recontouring their bodywork with the help of concrete.

Point being selecting a car based on contrived numbers is rather silly from top to bottom.

 

[IceGamer]

good point but again lap times is worthless to convey the goodness of the car. Eg. the C7 may set a good time but drives evil, and anyone who doesn't know how to drive a C7 is likely to end up spun out in the grass or recontouring their bodywork with the help of concrete.

Point being selecting a car based on contrived numbers is rather silly from top to bottom.

It is indeed but bragging rights are a thing and numbers are way more important than you think. Do you know how many people buy a car without doing any kind of research like at all? They’ve heard from a family member or friend something à they buy a car/ from a company
They’ve read something in a magazine à They buy a car
It’s actually mind-blowing how little effort some people put into buying a car… Some because they can simply afford it but most of the time it’s because they don’t care. They either want a reliable commuter/heavy duty or bragging rights car. If it also looks good in their eyes they buy that car. A red two door coupe is almost always a ‘Ferrari’… Most people really aren’t interested that much in cars. they all want a ‘nice one’ but that’s pretty much it.

Referring to your argumentation: I think reliable online numbers that have been achieved by skilled and experienced race drivers say a lot. Just look at the Nordschleife. Different cars, different driver, different conditions… Yet every somewhat important manufacturer wants to be on top of the list and a lot of people care about those things. However, I do get the point ‘kz’ made. I think what he is trying to say is that the 1/LE is better than a PP2 if driven by an individual like you and me and quite frankly I’ve heard that from almost everyone. Alpha platform > D2C.

 

[Bzal1122]

Naturally the newer generation prefers the computers to have all the fun for them. Soon the cars will all drive themselves and humans will do nothing but stare at screens and become the walking dead. I’m not a boomer but I can easily tell manuals are more engaging to drive. Only professionals who are competing need the extra lap time speed from their computer operated shifter. Most modern cars are fast enough without the extra .2 seconds they get from the AT. But I’m all for those who do order the autos……. increases my chance for the manual.

 

[akfinfan]

Naturally the newer generation prefers the computers to have all the fun for them. Soon the cars will all drive themselves and humans will do nothing but stare at screens and become the walking dead. I’m not a boomer but I can easily tell manuals are more engaging to drive. Only professionals who are competing need the extra lap time speed from their computer operated shifter. Most modern cars are fast enough without the extra .2 seconds they get from the AT. But I’m all for those who do order the autos……. increases my chance for the manual.

If you get a manual, it’s also less likely to get stolen!

 

[Gnatsum21]

The "interface" between steering wheel and gearbox is me! Been driving manuals most of my life. It's fun. I once owned a Chevy Caprice LT1 1996 (260 hp), that car was a blast to drive automatic. Wished I still had it.
As long I can get my hands on a manual I most likely will get it.

 

[Q6543]

All you manual enthusiasts need to be snatching up 13-14 Shelby gt500s…

that’s the real mustang that will tickle your taint

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