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shogun32

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If you're quibbling over 30HP or a few tenths of a second you need your head examined. Nobody cares. And if the people you hang with get all smug over such inconsequential trivialities, it's time to re-evaluate your association.

Have I slaughtered enough sacred cows yet?

 

Evo1986

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I am sorry, but as much as I like ford authority, this is bullshit. It was announced that the GT will have more than 487 BHP, and they (and their "sources") claim it will be as much as S550? If there is also one thing that they are good at, it is called clickbaiting....
 

IceGamer

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If you're quibbling over 30HP or a few tenths of a second you need your head examined. Nobody cares. And if the people you hang with get all smug over such inconsequential trivialities, it's time to re-evaluate your association.

Have I slaughtered enough sacred cows yet?
Aren’t you one of the guys who calls the Mustang a performance car first and foremost? If hp and numbers don’t matter to you then what does?
Besides, among my people no one really cares about such ‘inconsequential trivialities’ as most of them don’t care in general. So don’t you worry no smugs here… However, I do care about the numbers, especially if they don’t add up and that includes hp and pricing. 480+ hp for 40k sounds nice but if the reality is 400hp and 60K (and we here in Germany have to pay at least somewhat close to 60K or above to get a new GT) we talk about two completely different cars. If Ford advertises the GT with somewhat 480 hp I expect it to deliver that number on a dyno +- 3%. If you buy a German car and put it on a dyno it will most likely reproduce the advertised numbers and not undercut it by 60hp or even more.

I don't even know why anyone would defend such results...
 

shogun32

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I don't even know why anyone would defend such results...
well, the '450' is highly likely to be rubbish or missing important qualifiers - irreponsible and laughably sloppy journalism is that website's SOP. But 460-480 +0/-30 is just 6% and drive-line losses and/or other environmental effects EASILY account for that.

My point was who in their right mind says I'm going to spend 50,000 US/EU for 480HP crank, but not pull the trigger if it's 450HP crank?

If the DarkHorse legit reaches 500HP at the crank I will be amazed. Maybe they'll have a soft-overrev mode good for 5-7 seconds that lets you spin it to another 750 RPM.
 
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Dub347sbf

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If Ford advertises the GT with somewhat 480 hp I expect it to deliver that number on a dyno +- 3%. If you buy a German car and put it on a dyno it will most likely reproduce the advertised numbers and not undercut it by 60hp or even more.

I don't even know why anyone would defend such results...
You will see 480 +-3% on an engine dyno, not a chassis dyno. You have to calculate drivetrain losses for that. Ford is not over rating the engine. Some German manufacturers do tend to under rate theirs, for whatever reasons, but don't expect Ford to.
 


OppoLock

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480+ hp for 40k sounds nice but if the reality is 400hp and 60K (and we here in Germany have to pay at least somewhat close to 60K or above to get a new GT) we talk about two completely different cars. If Ford advertises the GT with somewhat 480 hp I expect it to deliver that number on a dyno +- 3%. If you buy a German car and put it on a dyno it will most likely reproduce the advertised numbers and not undercut it by 60hp or even more.

I don't even know why anyone would defend such results...
This sounds like low hanging fruit for anyone to jump on. I don’t want to make assumptions either.

Clarify for us, if the car claims 480bhp, are you expecting the car to dyno at 410-420 to back up the claim, or are you actually expecting it to dyno at 480 lol
 

Twin Turbo

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Worth clarifying, manufacturers quote crank HP, a dyno will quote rear wheel HP...........just making sure we're comparing apples to apples :)
 

Gogoggansgo

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For the people in the back oems don’t overrate for insurance reasons or even really anything else other than 2 scenarios
1) emissions a lot of times they’ll make the engine be an overachiever, because they’ll intentionally run the engine on crappy gas and or make the stock tune super super conservative for it’ll pass most emission standards worldwide. A lot of the European brands Are super guilty of this
2) to mess with the competition, if ford comes out and says the gen 4 coyote makes 480 but on 93 and good DA it’s making over 500hp, it’s a black eye to Chevy or whoever else you’re trying to race

besides that overrating isn’t really a thing they do intentionally the only brand that i know does it on purpose is McLaren
 

JWS

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Okay, Dark Horse has Dual 80mm Throttle Bodies. 52XS has Dual 65mm Throttle Bodies, although it does have a CobraJet Intake Manifold. It won’t have the 580 of the Aluminator and has smaller displacement, but If more Air Equates to more HP, then the Dark Horse should be able to, at least, have the 525+ HP of the Voodoo, even though it’s Cross Plane Crank. Considering Emissions and other Federal Regulations to make it 50 State Legal, it should provide enough HP to please Most Buyers.
1669215764572.jpeg
Ford Performance has taken the technology and hardware developed for the Shelby GT350 Mustang and has created the ultimate naturally aspirated, 5.2L cross-plane crankshaft crate engine. With a rating of 580 horsepower at 7,800 rpm, the new Aluminator 5.2 XS is the most powerful naturally aspirated modular crate engine ever built by Ford Performance. This is the worthy successor of our previous rendition-the "A50XS". Every Aluminator is hand assembled by the same technicians that build the Mustang Cobra Jet drag racing engines. Premium aftermarket components are used to ensure durability like; unique Manley® connecting rods, ARP® rod bolts, Mahle® forged pistons, forged steel crankshaft sprocket, and billet oil pump gears. Unique components developed specifically for the Cobra Jet racing program are used including Cobra Jet short runner-high RPM intake manifold, 1517 CFM dual 65mm Cobra Jet throttle body, and high RPM pulse ring. Ford Performance Engineers developed a balanced combination of high end, 580 horsepower and strong mid-range torque with the Cobra Jet intake manifold, unique camshafts and fully CNC ported GT350 cylinder heads.

P.S.

The new Dual Intake Arrangement of the 2024 might just make it a little easier to drop this thing right in!
 
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zstanny

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"Ford Performance has taken the technology and hardware developed for the Shelby GT350 Mustang and has created the ultimate naturally aspirated, 5.2L cross-plane crankshaft crate engine"

Ford - "we uh, yeah, back to cross-plane crank guys!"

Okay, Dark Horse has Dual 80mm Throttle Bodies. 52XS has Dual 65mm Throttle Bodies, although it does have a CobraJet Intake Manifold. It won’t have the 580 of the Aluminator and has smaller displacement, but If more Air Equates to more HP, then the Dark Horse should be able to, at least, have the 525+ HP of the Voodoo, even though it’s Cross Plane Crank. Considering Emissions and other Federal Regulations to make it 50 State Legal, it should provide enough HP to please Most Buyers.
1669215764572.jpeg
Ford Performance has taken the technology and hardware developed for the Shelby GT350 Mustang and has created the ultimate naturally aspirated, 5.2L cross-plane crankshaft crate engine. With a rating of 580 horsepower at 7,800 rpm, the new Aluminator 5.2 XS is the most powerful naturally aspirated modular crate engine ever built by Ford Performance. This is the worthy successor of our previous rendition-the "A50XS". Every Aluminator is hand assembled by the same technicians that build the Mustang Cobra Jet drag racing engines. Premium aftermarket components are used to ensure durability like; unique Manley® connecting rods, ARP® rod bolts, Mahle® forged pistons, forged steel crankshaft sprocket, and billet oil pump gears. Unique components developed specifically for the Cobra Jet racing program are used including Cobra Jet short runner-high RPM intake manifold, 1517 CFM dual 65mm Cobra Jet throttle body, and high RPM pulse ring. Ford Performance Engineers developed a balanced combination of high end, 580 horsepower and strong mid-range torque with the Cobra Jet intake manifold, unique camshafts and fully CNC ported GT350 cylinder heads.
 

Baldilocks

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You will see 480 +-3% on an engine dyno, not a chassis dyno. You have to calculate drivetrain losses for that. Ford is not over rating the engine. Some German manufacturers do tend to under rate theirs, for whatever reasons, but don't expect Ford to.

Yeah, BMW is notorious for that. The B58 engine in the M240i xDrive is rated at 382HP from the factory, but they are making 405HP at the wheels on the dyno. Crazy.
 
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because_murica

because_murica

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"Ford Performance has taken the technology and hardware developed for the Shelby GT350 Mustang and has created the ultimate naturally aspirated, 5.2L cross-plane crankshaft crate engine"

Ford - "we uh, yeah, back to cross-plane crank guys!"
The vibrations from the flat plane were just too much for some to handle.

 

Zelek

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It's sad that they left the redline at 7400 on the Mach 1. The good news is a tune can move it up to 8000 and without changing any parameters I wonder what the true HP value would be since it utilizes the 350 manifold. If they rev out the Dark Horse higher I bet they'll get that 500 hp number they want.
 

 
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