I got to drive a S650 for the first time recently.. I'm underwhelmed

[Karguy]

Best you don't buy a Mustang then

Welcome to the forum

Thank you ! As for the Mustang Ford should have designed a new chassis as neutral as the Alpha and bored the Coyote out to 5.8 liters to give it the Torque that makes a V8 fun…I had a ‘19 SS 1LE that everybody raves about but to be honest while the handling was better than a Mustang Mach 1 or the snap oversteer 5,6,7 Vettes as in neutral and predictable the car was not fun to drive…The engine was kind of flat , the interior cheap , useless trunk and no visibility…If you cant see you cant drive.The Mustang sounded great inside but the Coyote does not feel torquey at all but still stronger than the Vodoo which felt like a V-tec to me…Ended up with the one I never had on my radar screen because I read so much bad stuff about it…Always thought the Challenger WB was the best looking and most practical but was surprised how much fun it is…The 392/6.4 has a wave of Torque through the whole powerband and revs much quicker than a LT1…And also the handling is so much fun because it rotates into the turn I guess good leftover from the 2002 W211 E class when Mercedes was the parent company… As for the Mustang I hope there will be a gen 8 that is lighter with a 5.8 V8 or if not maybe Ford can give the Coyote 10 mm more bore and give us some knobs instead of greasy paw prints on the screen because if new the Mustang and M2,3,4 if you can live without V8 sound are the only game in town as in semi affordable , practical sporty cars with decent power and a manual transmission !

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[MikeyV]

This comparison makes no sense. I think the 9 year and probably 80k mile difference, along with it being a whole new generation more than justifies the price difference.
You’re getting a brand new updated coyote with the option of an updated 10r80 (which wasnt even an option then) or a 6r80. The capabilities of these cars haven’t even been explored yet, and theres already some in 10’s with stock factory tune.
If the performance upgrades don’t convince you then the interior is also a huge update. The screens make it look much more modern, regardless of whether you like them or not. The materials are much higher quality and its a much more comfortable ride, especially if with magneride (which again wasn’t even available then).
FURTHERMORE, I can turn my car on from my phone while im sitting on the toilet taking a dump. And the list keeps going.
I think the early s550 is an amazing platform and a steal for 17k. You should be out enjoying it rather than looking for validation. By your logic we should’ve all bought foxbodies since they came with the 5.oh anyway

"Whole new Generation" - c'mon now. It's no better than an S550 because it is an S550 - but heavier!

 

[horned-toad]

unless there is a seachange in political/ecological goals, there won't be any Gen8 that's not a slightly gussied up Gen7.

A new platform costs $$$$$ and time. Mustang has been selling well enough despite it's many deficiencies and competitive shortcomings.

 

[RJV15]

unless there is a seachange in political/ecological goals, there won't be any Gen8 that's not a slightly gussied up Gen7.

A new platform costs $$$$$ and time. Mustang has been selling well enough despite it's many deficiencies and competitive shortcomings.

Not to mention the lack of competition.

Ford said they want to keep making the V8 Mustang, but that doesn't mean they will be able to. That uncertainty will make it difficult to justify a new chassis.

 

[Karguy]

They wasted a lot of money on the Mach-E and F150 Lightning so I hope they learned their lesson and put some money into a bigger bore Coyote and new chassis that also sheds some weight to give us something more exciting to look forward to ! With the Camaro and Challenger gone the market should be big enough for Ford to spend some money on real upgrades as the gen7 so far is some lipstick on the old horse ! Too much money as as it is it feels like a $45K car to me with the Tremec included and why twin throttle bodies for the same power makes no sense to me neither as the new screens will look cheap and out of date quick…I mean analog gauges look timeless and a center screen with real knobs instead of greasy paw prints would be the way to go…Also a front end reminiscent of the originals as in retro done right like the did with the Bronco would have been cool with that bigger bore engine for more bottom end and mid-range Torque that made the old and light Fox bodies so much fun

 

[Karguy]

I think if Ford wont/cant spend $$$ on a new Mustang they should update the current one with a 5.8 Coyote , some knobs you can push and turn to keep the paw prints off the screen and some more comfortable electric adjustable Recaros and with the Tremec included sell it as a 5.8 GT/R or 351 Boss for $55K…Make the profits by selling more units rather than overpricing the few they sell ! Shouldn’t be that tough with the competition gone being the last V8 with a (Tremec) manual…

 

[9secondko]

unless there is a seachange in political/ecological goals, there won't be any Gen8 that's not a slightly gussied up Gen7.

A new platform costs $$$$$ and time. Mustang has been selling well enough despite it's many deficiencies and competitive shortcomings.

which is a slightly gussied up gen 6 which is a gussied up gen 5.

a new platform costs money? No kidding. It’s called an investment. Ford has saved more than its share over the last twenty freaking years of mustang. People aren’t as excited for another little change to a very old car. They want something special. The sales numbers have been hugely depressing for s650. Because everyone who has an s550 already has one. No need to buy the new car. It performs about the same as last gen, looks about the same, and pretty much IS the same. Only somehow heavier and more expensive.

it’s time for a new platform.
We’ve heard Ford try to placate us telling us that the Mustang is so special that it will get its own platform. Well so far that’s a lie. It’s merely carried on its aging platform from the s197 era. The freaking Mach e grocery getter has had far more investment and marketing push.

it is a sucky time to be a Mustang fan. It’s like we keep hoping and hoping and hoping… and nothing.

no other car has such heartfelt attachment from its fans. And instead of developing that car to its potential and winning over NEW fans, it’s like Ford just wants to squeeze the fandom as much as possible with little tears of greatness that never materialized. It’s gotten old.

 

[Gregs24]

They wasted a lot of money on the Mach-E and F150 Lightning so I hope they learned their lesson and put some money into a bigger bore Coyote and new chassis that also sheds some weight to give us something more exciting to look forward to ! With the Camaro and Challenger gone the market should be big enough for Ford to spend some money on real upgrades as the gen7 so far is some lipstick on the old horse ! Too much money as as it is it feels like a $45K car to me with the Tremec included and why twin throttle bodies for the same power makes no sense to me neither as the new screens will look cheap and out of date quick…I mean analog gauges look timeless and a center screen with real knobs instead of greasy paw prints would be the way to go…Also a front end reminiscent of the originals as in retro done right like the did with the Bronco would have been cool with that bigger bore engine for more bottom end and mid-range Torque that made the old and light Fox bodies so much fun

You are going to need a time machine to back to what you want

 

[Gregs24]

I think if Ford wont/cant spend $$$ on a new Mustang they should update the current one with a 5.8 Coyote , some knobs you can push and turn to keep the paw prints off the screen and some more comfortable electric adjustable Recaros and with the Tremec included sell it as a 5.8 GT/R or 351 Boss for $55K…Make the profits by selling more units rather than overpricing the few they sell ! Shouldn’t be that tough with the competition gone being the last V8 with a (Tremec) manual…

Alright you have made your point. Just posting the same words over and over doesn't make it any more valid. Give it a rest now.

 

[Gregs24]

which is a slightly gussied up gen 6 which is a gussied up gen 5.

a new platform costs money? No kidding. It’s called an investment. Ford has saved more than its share over the last twenty freaking years of mustang. People aren’t as excited for another little change to a very old car. They want something special. The sales numbers have been hugely depressing for s650. Because everyone who has an s550 already has one. No need to buy the new car. It performs about the same as last gen, looks about the same, and pretty much IS the same. Only somehow heavier and more expensive.

it’s time for a new platform.
We’ve heard Ford try to placate us telling us that the Mustang is so special that it will get its own platform. Well so far that’s a lie. It’s merely carried on its aging platform from the s197 era. The freaking Mach e grocery getter has had far more investment and marketing push.

it is a sucky time to be a Mustang fan. It’s like we keep hoping and hoping and hoping… and nothing.

no other car has such heartfelt attachment from its fans. And instead of developing that car to its potential and winning over NEW fans, it’s like Ford just wants to squeeze the fandom as much as possible with little tears of greatness that never materialized. It’s gotten old.

If there is an S750 you will get your new platform, because it will be a hybrid.

 

[lcbrownz]

More millennials stop and stare at my S197 red vert (while parked in a public place) than go to the local Ford dealership to look at new S650s. Most kids (these days in my neighborhood) want a new Bronco over a Mustang. Did you ever notice Ford is advertising the hell out of the Bronco and very little for the Mustang?

 

[Zig]

More millennials stop and stare at my S197 red vert (while parked in a public place) than go to the local Ford dealership to look at new S650s. Most kids (these days in my neighborhood) want a new Bronco over a Mustang. Did you ever notice Ford is advertising the hell out of the Bronco and very little for the Mustang?

In these parts, I’d be tempted to say more people have driven around and stared with beady little eyes at ours than have seen a live bronco.

 

[lcbrownz]

In these parts, I’d be tempted to say more people have driven around and stared with beady little eyes at ours than have seen a live bronco.

In my little neck of the woods, more single folks are driving used Hondas Civics with an extra loud muffler than new Mustangs.

 

[roadpilot]

Must be whiny millennial Thursday ...

 

[V10]

The article on the GT350R pretty much echos what you are saying in comparing it to the Z28 with Trofeos. But we, can only go with the times we have regardless of tires.
https://www.caranddriver.com/featur...-shelby-gt350r-at-lightning-lap-2016-feature/

My question is why isn't Ford providing DHs with the carbon fiber wheels for these tests? Also, the DH they tested was the heavier automatic. It would be nice to see the lighter manual transmission and the carbon wheels tested for this tracks.

CF wheels are only for the cream of the crop mustangs. The DH maybe "special" in that its one of the first S650, but when the S650 is production ends, at the end of the day its the base engine model, not special as the other real "special cars". Not sure if you own a DH, I'm not trying to knock it. But history of the mustang has always been the higher end getting the goodies.

No way Ford is going to put CF wheels or brakes on the lowest tier. There's actually no way for them to move up had they put CF wheels. Like what option can they do from that point? Magnesium wheels that are center lock?

Also the 2016 times are so old and tire tech from those days to today has improved immensely. Like compare Viper ACR's Kumho tires, at that time they were incredible, but compared to the Cup2 R of yester year and now the new top dog, Trofeo RS, the tires from 2016 arent even close.

Turn in track out https://www.youtube.com/@TurninTrackOut had videos comparing a GT2 RS vs a Viper ACR and the Cup 2 R is anywhere from .9-1.4 seconds faster than the cup 2 R. He took down the video but I've asked him to repost it. A lot of good technical data, done on the same day, same tire comparison, all driven by him. Dude is a faster driver than Randy Pobst. Guy ran a 1:27.50 at Laguna Seca in a 765 LT on stock tires with a passenger. Thats got to be a production record.

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