Is MotorTrend right about the new S650?

[Jivor]

What I really hate about the challenger is you get people like him defending a bad design because it's retro. Of the three pony cars, the challenger has the worst fundamental proportions and profile. It has a cool looking grille, and lights, but everything else looks significantly worse than the mustang, and even the Camaro. Like the overall shape of the car I mean, just looks bulky and ungainly to me.

The Chally is a modified Mercedes E-class platform that became the LX platform. I had a 2010 R/T, and while it was a very retro looking car which I did have a lot of fun with (it was my first V8), I can tell you that the handling was prehistoric, though a bit better than the 2003 v6 Mustang that I trading in for it with the Mustang's outdated solid rear axle. The Challenger was not a fan of wet slicked roads, nor of gusting crosswinds. I will say that the Challenger does not hold up to the 2024 GT I just bought, not by a mile and change.

Sponsored

 

[marcekb]

I also think the s550 sounded better with exhausts which is the greatest disappointment for me since I'm obsessed with sound and is the whole reason I wanted a V8 and I've spent countless hours watching exhaust videos.

I've had both. The s650 is unequivocally better. Volume is the same in both. Engine has the same rumble. The s650 wins in pops and gurgles. Hands down.

that V-8 sound in track mode well, there’s nothing like it.

Agree for both cars, but per above, the pops are so much better in the new one. The old one was good though...

 

[MagneticMartian]

I've had both. The s650 is unequivocally better. Volume is the same in both. Engine has the same rumble. The s650 wins in pops and gurgles. Hands down.



Agree for both cars, but per above, the pops are so much better in the new one. The old one was good though...

The active exhaust stock I agree is better than s550 active exhaust stock but what I meant is the sound with aftermarket exhausts or a simple muffler delete/straight pipe it sounds a lot more airy and higher pitched to me with the few exhausts that I've seen on the s650 whereas the s550 had a bit of a deeper tone in my opinion.

I'm going to be practically straight piping it with a muffler delete and H pipe to see how it sounds soon so maybe that will change my mind.



This video is my ideal sound with the s550, if I can get this car to be close I'll be happy.

 

[DeluxeStang]

The only thing I really agree with is that it's a missed opportunity. Hard to know what kind of logistical battles they had to fight when developing this thing, but I do have a strong opinion that there's a huge X factor missing, from packaging, lack of innovation, and pricing. It's like the iPhone 15 if you had the 14, except Apple let you know this was the last phone they're making. You expect WAY more. But if you didn't have an iPhone, or you own say an 11, it's still an accomplished product worth buying.

Jonny Lieberman is insufferable though. To his credit, he's highly opinionated and I'd rather hold a conversation with someone confidently voiced than a people-pleaser. I follow him on IG and find myself disagreeing with his design statements way more often than not.

Note that this is the kind of guy who openly stated that this is a brilliant design:

He also said this was a compromised and flawed design.

 

[DarthMalice]

spot on if you ask me except all the exterior changes from the hood vent back are pretty much Camaro except for the Pacman rear lights...that was Hyundai.
center hood vent...yep; reduced accent lines on doors...yep; thin headlights, boxier front, black backing on DH on front...yep; enhanced rear haunches...yep; body color hood lid...yep; bunker black bumper...yep.

I also finally sat in a premium while my Mach 1 was being serviced as a sales guy tried to get me to trade in. Anyone saying the interior is massively upgraded is just not being objective. There are a few surfaces that were done differently-plenty of hard plastic in the same areas to go around-doors...center console etc. The seating areas have that cloth thing going on, but I am not even sure if that is more premium...it is different. The steering wheel, screens and the center stack are the big difference and let's face it...the screens have been controversial at best...a vote would probably see a majority saying no. The wheel itself is better but you can keep the Bronco center design...I would rather switch mine to a 350/500 one. The irony is how well they integrated the bigger screen on the bronco interior and even kept a digital gauge cluster like the S550 vs. the Mustang...they should have stole that too with the steering wheel and we might not be having this divisive conversation.

 

[S650 GT]

I'm going to go against the grain here, I know nobody likes to talk badly about what they spent their life savings on but I will give my honest opinion. I had an s550 ecoboost and test drove a bunch of s550 GT's and was very close to buying one but waited for the 2024. I now have the 2024 GT Premium Vapor Blue with the Performance Pack and active exhaust, pretty much every package except recaro seats. It has been about a month now so the honeymoon period is wearing off and I have to say I feel like it is a step down from the s550. The only thing changed in the interior is the dash and steering wheel as the seats and doors are the same, the gears don't show unless you switch to manual mode unlike the s550 (minor issue) and the digital dash looks worse than an s550.

In terms of exterior the s550 (2018+) looked very sleek with a lot more body lines and could look absolutely amazing modded and lowered and had a huge aftermarket because of that reason. The s650 in my opinion looks much more bulky and fat which I get is more like a muscle car but I just prefer the design of the 2018+ s550 especially the back. I also don't see much exterior modding potential because I just can't imagine anything that can make it look better other than a different front splitter or exhaust tips. The S550 also has much higher torque on every dyno and seems to beat the s650 in a race in anything but perfect conditions which should not be happening but they're close enough that speed doesn't really matter to me and my s650 is my daily driver.

I also think the s550 sounded better with exhausts which is the greatest disappointment for me since I'm obsessed with sound and is the whole reason I wanted a V8 and I've spent countless hours watching exhaust videos. So personally I think this car is a downgrade from the s550, the only thing it has going for it is that it is new and there are a million s550s out there so I'll enjoy being unique for a while.

I totally agree with you. I had a S550 2016 V6 and a S550 2019 GT and agree with all the points.
I also respect your unbiased point of view even when you spent your hard working money on something. Many would back their car up just because it's theirs. There are also other who own a S550 and like to bash the S650 just because they feel that their car is getting old. At this time I have none, but I would go for the S650, just because it is a newer car and it is not that bad. I just wished it was slightly faster and has some slightly improvements exterior and interiorwise. Well, maybe I wait for a refresh or just take it as it is.

 

[FredBGT]

I don't put much stock in Motor Trend's opinions. All I'm concerned with is numbers like 0-60, braking distance, quarter mile et. My likes are very different than theirs. I like the S650 now but didn't when it was shown. The front end is way better than the S550 which I never liked. Don't like the slabside quarters ripped off a Camaro, which I find uglier than the S550. Like the new headlights better than S550. Window sill looks lower on the S650 and looks much better to me. Most new cars have too little glass area which reduces visibility and I suspect, is a significant contributor to accidents.

Interior I don't care much about. Have daily driven gutted cars and been happy so long as I have a good seat, shifter, heater and instrumentation. That being said the S650 interior looks nice. I have come to accept that screens are going to be here to stay.

I haven't driven a newer Mustang GT than the 2014 so I can't speak to the S550 specifically but compared to my old Challenger the 2014 was better in every way except ride quality. Challenger was too soft. The transmission was a Mercedes WA580; very soft. Chrysler 300, Dodge Charger and Challenger all use the same chassis. Frankly, the new Challenger has looked bloated and squished up like a caricature of the originals. This is how I feel about most retro designs. The requirements are different than they were 50 years ago. Those cars were designed with beauty in mind not pedestrian or occupant safety, aerodynamics for fuel economy, etc. I agree with Lieberman in regards to the Alfa. Manufacturers should be looking forward. Automobiles can still be designed solely with beauty in mind but that doesn't matter because a manufacturer cannot sell it if it doesn't meet these modern requirements. I don't think the S650 is a beautiful design in a way that is comparable to past automobiles but it is much better than the current pack and anything built in the last several years.

Everyone's tastes are different so my opinion is or should be invalid for anyone but myself.

 

[young at heart]

I've had both. The s650 is unequivocally better. Volume is the same in both. Engine has the same rumble. The s650 wins in pops and gurgles. Hands down.



Agree for both cars, but per above, the pops are so much better in the new one. The old one was good though...

You‘ve obviously heard them both and I haven’t heard an S650 in person so I’d have to [skeptically maybe?] take your word for it. It’s hard for me to imagine a car sounding better than my two stock ‘23s in track mode and still being able (so far) to carefully sneak by law enforcement. Having said that, my ‘23s are both Mach 1s and they’re a little throatier than the GTs so there’s that. But my ‘20 GT sounds great in track mode too, admittedly though the top is always down so…

Truth is, even stock all these V-8 Mustangs with AVE sound so good it’s unbelievable. I didn’t realize just how big a part that played in their appeal until I became an owner.

 

[agreywolfe]

You‘ve obviously heard them both and I haven’t heard an S650 in person so I’d have to [skeptically maybe?] take your word for it. It’s hard for me to imagine a car sounding better than my two stock ‘23s in track mode and still being able (so far) to carefully sneak by law enforcement. Having said that, my ‘23s are both Mach 1s and they’re a little throatier than the GTs so there’s that. But my ‘20 GT sounds great in track mode too, admittedly though the top is always down so…

Truth is, even stock all these V-8 Mustangs with AVE sound so good it’s unbelievable. I didn’t realize just how big a part that played in their appeal until I became an owner.

you can hear the comparison in the video Steeda posted in their x-pipe thread. while the S650 is not too much louder, it definitely has a better sound (imo) than the S550 AV. comparisons near the end around the 11:30 mark. heres the thread

 

[marcekb]

The active exhaust stock I agree is better than s550 active exhaust stock but what I meant is the sound with aftermarket exhausts or a simple muffler delete/straight pipe it sounds a lot more airy and higher pitched to me with the few exhausts that I've seen on the s650 whereas the s550 had a bit of a deeper tone in my opinion.

I'm going to be practically straight piping it with a muffler delete and H pipe to see how it sounds soon so maybe that will change my mind.



This video is my ideal sound with the s550, if I can get this car to be close I'll be happy.

That's a great point. My personal experience is only with the AVE's. But I have heard (via video, which is often not great) an H-piped s650 that sounded so good, I'm thinking of adding it. The car in the video you attached sounds fabulous.

 

[Ace]

Each to their own opinion. To me the Gen 7 easily beats the Gen 6 by miles visually, and I already loved the Gen 6. If you put both next to each other, the Gen 6 just looks dated, especially with the ugly lights in the lower bumper.

 

[S650 GT]

Each to their own opinion. To me the Gen 7 easily beats the Gen 6 by miles visually, and I already loved the Gen 6. If you put both next to each other, the Gen 6 just looks dated, especially with the ugly lights in the lower bumper.

The front yes, the rear no. And both pictures are not a fair comparison.
GT vs Ecoboost and the quad tips and PP spoiler on the S650.

 

[Ace]

The front yes, the rear no. And both pictures are not a fair comparison.
GT vs Ecoboost and the quad tips and PP spoiler on the S650.

2015-2017 had no quad exhaust or high wing option... GT only has other badges, grille fangs and hood vents as visual differences to an Ecoboost

 

[S650 GT]

2015-2017 had no quad exhaust or high wing option... GT only has other badges, grille fangs and hood vents as visual differences to an Ecoboost

I know, but the closest comparison of a Gen 5 tot a gen 6 is the facelift model and those have quad tips and PP wing.

 

[JamesAnd]

Each to their own opinion. To me the Gen 7 easily beats the Gen 6 by miles visually, and I already loved the Gen 6. If you put both next to each other, the Gen 6 just looks dated, especially with the ugly lights in the lower bumper.

The S650 appears to be a good looking car and so was the S550 pre the facelift. I just don’t know what happened to the design department with the 2018 facelift S550 cars!
I read somewhere that Ford had a lot of criticism from market research groups on the S550 facelift and that’s why didn’t adopt it on the Shelbys and they moved away from it on the S650, it looks more pre facelift.

Sponsored