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Car & Driver - 2024 Ford Mustang Ecoboost

Crew4991

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Car and Driver: Sounds like stink. 💩
Me: How is that different than any other ecopoop year since inception?

Good overall review though. Shared many of the points that I thought when I first saw the new models hit the dealer lots. Definitely sad they took the manual tranny away from the Ecoboost and reserved it only for the GTs. More fitting for the GT and probably saves Ford a lot of production cost for simplicity but still sad that fewer people with a smaller budget will not get to enjoy a new manual mustang.
 

SAL-E

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He has his opinion, but I for one love the new dash. As for eager upshifts, I feel mine borderline lugs the engine in some circumstances, so I find myself forcing and appreciating the upshifts.

It is an excellent car for my needs.
 

Supra Killer

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"CVT-wannabe 10-speed auto"

What? Care to expand on that-No, not at all? Understandable, have a great day.
 

Hack

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4.5 0-60 - wow. That's awesome.
 


Dena

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4.5 0-60 - wow. That's awesome.
The 96 GT V8 was only 210 Horse power. The Cobra was about 100 more. While I am not found of 4 bangers because of their roughness, they are more than able to do the job and can do it more economically than anything else.
 

Hack

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The 96 GT V8 was only 210 Horse power. The Cobra was about 100 more. While I am not found of 4 bangers because of their roughness, they are more than able to do the job and can do it more economically than anything else.
My biggest issue with them is the direct injection systems, overall complexity and the cost to manufacture. Yes, they save a small amount of gasoline energy, but manufacturing and then replacing engines in a short amount of time takes waaaay more energy than just using a simpler V8 engine that will last nearly forever and is inexpensive to rebuild if worn.

It's a false savings that doesn't really save energy in the end. What it does is give the manufacturer planned obsolescence.
 

Dena

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My biggest issue with them is the direct injection systems, overall complexity and the cost to manufacture. Yes, they save a small amount of gasoline energy, but manufacturing and then replacing engines in a short amount of time takes waaaay more energy than just using a simpler V8 engine that will last nearly forever and is inexpensive to rebuild if worn.

It's a false savings that doesn't really save energy in the end. What it does is give the manufacturer planned obsolescence.
Direct injection is about getting more horsepower out of the engine with lower grade fuel. Knocks happen around top dead center and by delaying the burn after that, you can get more fuel in the cylinder upping the horsepower. You could accomplish the same thing with really high octane but nobody wants to go there and keep the price of fuel cheap.
 
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Bikeman315

Bikeman315

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Direct injection is about getting more horsepower out of the engine with lower grade fuel. Knocks happen around top dead center and by delaying the burn after that, you can get more fuel in the cylinder upping the horsepower. You could accomplish the same thing with really high octane but nobody wants to go there and keep the price of fuel cheap.
Hack doesn’t like direct injection, period. But the 2024 Ecoboost has both direct and port injection. You can save the walnuts for the squirrels.
 

SAL-E

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Maybe he doesn't realize that his 'simple' V8 also has direct injection using the very same dual injection system that the 2024 Mustang Ecoboost now has.
 

Hack

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Direct injection is about getting more horsepower out of the engine with lower grade fuel. Knocks happen around top dead center and by delaying the burn after that, you can get more fuel in the cylinder upping the horsepower. You could accomplish the same thing with really high octane but nobody wants to go there and keep the price of fuel cheap.
I would prefer to see the engine run a little richer to control knock instead of using DI, which produces particulates. Or just "right size" the engine instead of over boosting it.

Maybe he doesn't realize that his 'simple' V8 also has direct injection using the very same dual injection system that the 2024 Mustang Ecoboost now has.
That's why I own a 2017 Mustang rather than something newer. No DI in that engine. Easier and cheaper to fix and work on. Makes decent power. I bought the Camaro despite DI though, so I guess I'm a little hypocritical in that way. At least the Camaro has a good amount of cubic inches. But don't get me started on AFM. I'm planning to disassemble the engine and get rid of the collapsing lifters once the Camaro's warranty is up.
 

Dena

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I would prefer to see the engine run a little richer to control knock instead of using DI, which produces particulates. Or just "right size" the engine instead of over boosting it.
Two points. Direct injection should be minimall with most of the fuel coming from port injection under normal load. They may need to move a little fuel through the injectors to ensure they don't get blocked by carbon buildup. Under heavy load Direct injection would provide more fuel but most of the time you're not running in that mode.

Once upon a time. There I go again. Diesels used to billow black smoke. In those days nobody heard about laser machining and the holes in injectors had to be made with very small drills. Sometime probably around the early 70's, diesels stopped smoking so bad even under a very heavy load. Some of it was due to turbo charging but much of it was the result of better injector design. More much smaller holes resulting in the fuel almost becoming a fog producing a very clean burn compared to before. I am pretty sure that gas injected into a active burn will result in a pretty clean burn. Remember that unburned fuel would be gases next to the cylinder wall where the metal might cool it and prevent it from burning. An injector puts the fuel in the center of the cylinder where it only come in contact with hot gases.

Besides that, my 96 which is port injection only deposits a gray ash on the inside of the exhaust pipe. it's far less that the black deposits on a carbureted car so you can reduce the particles but your not going to completely eliminate them unless your burning hydrogen. I don't have the ability to analyze it but I suspect the gray ash isn't carbon but is instead impurities in the fuel that don't burn. If you look at the ashes from a wood or charcoal fire, you will see much the same thing. If that was carbon, it would have burned but there are things like calcium and minerals in the water that becomes a part of the wood and are only freed by fire.
 

Hack

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Two points. Direct injection should be minimall with most of the fuel coming from port injection under normal load. They may need to move a little fuel through the injectors to ensure they don't get blocked by carbon buildup. Under heavy load Direct injection would provide more fuel but most of the time you're not running in that mode.

Once upon a time. There I go again. Diesels used to billow black smoke. In those days nobody heard about laser machining and the holes in injectors had to be made with very small drills. Sometime probably around the early 70's, diesels stopped smoking so bad even under a very heavy load. Some of it was due to turbo charging but much of it was the result of better injector design. More much smaller holes resulting in the fuel almost becoming a fog producing a very clean burn compared to before. I am pretty sure that gas injected into a active burn will result in a pretty clean burn. Remember that unburned fuel would be gases next to the cylinder wall where the metal might cool it and prevent it from burning. An injector puts the fuel in the center of the cylinder where it only come in contact with hot gases.

Besides that, my 96 which is port injection only deposits a gray ash on the inside of the exhaust pipe. it's far less that the black deposits on a carbureted car so you can reduce the particles but your not going to completely eliminate them unless your burning hydrogen. I don't have the ability to analyze it but I suspect the gray ash isn't carbon but is instead impurities in the fuel that don't burn. If you look at the ashes from a wood or charcoal fire, you will see much the same thing. If that was carbon, it would have burned but there are things like calcium and minerals in the water that becomes a part of the wood and are only freed by fire.
You make a lot of good points.

To be clear about my position, I don't want double the injectors in my engine. I think it's a waste of money. It makes the engine more difficult to work on and there are more parts to break.

I also hate the PWTA cylinder liners in the newer Ford V8s. Throw away engine blocks. That's just lovely (sarcasm).
 

Dena

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You make a lot of good points.

To be clear about my position, I don't want double the injectors in my engine. I think it's a waste of money. It makes the engine more difficult to work on and there are more parts to break.

I also hate the PWTA cylinder liners in the newer Ford V8s. Throw away engine blocks. That's just lovely (sarcasm).
Direct injection gas dates back to the first Vets. If you want simple, go back to the carburetor.
I understand what your saying about the cylinder walls but the coyote engine has been around for over 12 years now and it seems to hold up pretty well. If the engine will last the life of the car, rebuilding it really isn't an issue.
 

Hack

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Direct injection gas dates back to the first Vets. If you want simple, go back to the carburetor.
I understand what your saying about the cylinder walls but the coyote engine has been around for over 12 years now and it seems to hold up pretty well. If the engine will last the life of the car, rebuilding it really isn't an issue.
Corvettes had fuel injection in the 60s, but that was port injection - not direct injection. Why would I want a carb? They are overly complicated and a PITA to constantly adjust and clean. Port fuel injection is the sweet spot for engine technology that is perfectly functional without any over-complication.

The Coyote aluminum block 2011-2017 with iron cylinder liners I don't have any complaints about.
Sponsored

 
 




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