Do you think S650 Mustang Sales Will Start Increasing Now?

[Frogdog1]

It's interest rates. A lot of people just look at MSRP then go straight to the monthly payment. A GT is recreation for a LOT of people. Hell, people finance mods or all the aftermarket places wouldn't offer terms for toy add on's.

When people want toys for recreation, they get them whether it's a car or a boat or a vacation they can't afford. Debt is preventing sales of a lot of things. Most people apparently don't mind debt because most people can't pay cash because they don't have it. People aren't willing to live small, temporarily. There wouldn't be the dirty finance offices if this weren't true. A clerk can do titles and licenses. Most people look at the "muntly payment". So do car sellers. That's where they make money, in SELLING cars. Debt for toys is stupid, especially mods......which is crazy. Just another opinion. Go for it.

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[gtstang462002]

Honestly, sales will stay the same or decline over the next couple of years. Sadly, the new Mustang didn't get the takers that Ford projected. I go to a lot of car cruises with my 2024 GT. Three weeks ago, I attended a cruise in a small mill town. We had over 1500 cars on the streets. I counted 4 S650 Mustangs including mine. There were a lot of older Mustangs.
The price of the new GT is driving people away from the showroom. I see more people buying used clean low mile used muscle cars for 3/4 the price. The money isn't there for a new fun car. My S650 is probably my last fun car at my age.
The car business has changed folks!

See, I went the opposite direction. I wanted an 03-04 cobra to replace my '02 GT that I had. When I started shopping around everyone that was willing to sell were wanting 30-50k for a 20+ year old car that has rode hard and put away wet. I decided for that money I was just going to buy a new car that I could beat on myself.

 

[AzkAdAsh]

Is that why dealers love special orders that are actual sales?

Dealerships want you to buy a car that's already on the lot because they've already paid for it. If they don't sell it then it sits as an overhead expense on the budget sheet. When you special order a car, it doesn't affect their budget unless the buyer backs out after the VIN is issued.

That's why there's almost always a non-refundable deposit associated with a special order. That deposit does two things: It acts as earnest money by creating a vested interest in the buyer to see the sale through. It also covers costs associated with dealer stocking and maintenance costs if the buyer backs out.

This is also why dealer markups are so prevalent on special orders. With special orders, the dealer is just the middle-man between the manufacturer and you. With lot stock, they can sticker price the car with those dealer stocking fees and what not in order to offset the cost of keeping it on the lot and a little extra for the dealership to actually turn a profit. Those profit margins are significantly reduced when you special order one from the factory.

That's why the 2024 Dark Horse's were being ordered with $5,000, $10,000, and even $15,000 ADMs. Dealerships were only given a set number of allotments, and most dealers didn't order DHs to sit on the lot because of how much more they cost, the limited number of allotments, and if they built one for the lot, it might not be spec'd the way a potential buy would want. It's a risk. It was better to make $5k on the ADM of a special order that a buyer was more likely to not back out of after a deposit was made than to spend the $80k+ to order one for the lot and hope that it's a spec that someone will buy.

 

[AzkAdAsh]

or "torquey"

like the 6.4 Dodge or 6.2 GM doesn't exist.

Yeah. This is from people who are only directly comparing it to the Eco-4. They forget that this is still only a 307. Not even the biggest V8 to sit in a Mustang. That being said, I wouldn't mind a modern 429.

 

[AzkAdAsh]

So where do those second hand cars come from without new cars?

Regrets and Repos

 

[Gregs24]

Regrets and Repos

My point was there are no second hand cars if they are never built. No new cars = No second hand cars!

 

[AzkAdAsh]

My point was there are no second hand cars if they are never built. No new cars = No second hand cars!

I understand that and I was adding on that in the context of the Mustang resale market a lot of them come from people who regret their purchase or people who couldn't afford them but bought them anyway. I wasn't disagreeing with you. I was making your point.

 

[350 Feet]

Dealerships want you to buy a car that's already on the lot because they've already paid for it. If they don't sell it then it sits as an overhead expense on the budget sheet. When you special order a car, it doesn't affect their budget unless the buyer backs out after the VIN is issued.

That's why there's almost always a non-refundable deposit associated with a special order. That deposit does two things: It acts as earnest money by creating a vested interest in the buyer to see the sale through. It also covers costs associated with dealer stocking and maintenance costs if the buyer backs out.

This is also why dealer markups are so prevalent on special orders. With special orders, the dealer is just the middle-man between the manufacturer and you. With lot stock, they can sticker price the car with those dealer stocking fees and what not in order to offset the cost of keeping it on the lot and a little extra for the dealership to actually turn a profit. Those profit margins are significantly reduced when you special order one from the factory.

That's why the 2024 Dark Horse's were being ordered with $5,000, $10,000, and even $15,000 ADMs. Dealerships were only given a set number of allotments, and most dealers didn't order DHs to sit on the lot because of how much more they cost, the limited number of allotments, and if they built one for the lot, it might not be spec'd the way a potential buy would want. It's a risk. It was better to make $5k on the ADM of a special order that a buyer was more likely to not back out of after a deposit was made than to spend the $80k+ to order one for the lot and hope that it's a spec that someone will buy.

Most all new cars at a dealership are financed from the manufacturer, on what is called a “Floor plan”. They still want to unload the cars because they cost the dealership a percentage every month.

 

[350 Feet]

Yeah. This is from people who are only directly comparing it to the Eco-4. They forget that this is still only a 307. Not even the biggest V8 to sit in a Mustang. That being said, I wouldn't mind a modern 429.

I’ll take my “317” any day, and twice on Sundays!

 

[Zig]

Dealerships want you to buy a car that's already on the lot because they've already paid for it. If they don't sell it then it sits as an overhead expense on the budget sheet. When you special order a car, it doesn't affect their budget unless the buyer backs out after the VIN is issued.

That's why there's almost always a non-refundable deposit associated with a special order. That deposit does two things: It acts as earnest money by creating a vested interest in the buyer to see the sale through. It also covers costs associated with dealer stocking and maintenance costs if the buyer backs out.

This is also why dealer markups are so prevalent on special orders. With special orders, the dealer is just the middle-man between the manufacturer and you. With lot stock, they can sticker price the car with those dealer stocking fees and what not in order to offset the cost of keeping it on the lot and a little extra for the dealership to actually turn a profit. Those profit margins are significantly reduced when you special order one from the factory.

That's why the 2024 Dark Horse's were being ordered with $5,000, $10,000, and even $15,000 ADMs. Dealerships were only given a set number of allotments, and most dealers didn't order DHs to sit on the lot because of how much more they cost, the limited number of allotments, and if they built one for the lot, it might not be spec'd the way a potential buy would want. It's a risk. It was better to make $5k on the ADM of a special order that a buyer was more likely to not back out of after a deposit was made than to spend the $80k+ to order one for the lot and hope that it's a spec that someone will buy.

Are we implying they don’t get paid unless it sits on the lot?

 

[AzkAdAsh]

Are we implying they don’t get paid unless it sits on the lot?

No. I'm not saying that. I'm saying that the cars that are on the lot are already "paid for" by the dealership and so they want to sell those as quickly as possible to get that money back from whoever is financing the car, often through manufacturer financing or dealership financing/ preferred partnerships with lenders. They have more of a vested interest in selling the cars on the lot over ordering another one.

 

[AzkAdAsh]

Most all new cars at a dealership are financed from the manufacturer, on what is called a “Floor plan”. They still want to unload the cars because they cost the dealership a percentage every month.

I simplified that by just saying the dealership already paid for it, but yes.

 

[Zig]

No. I'm not saying that. I'm saying that the cars that are on the lot are already "paid for" by the dealership and so they want to sell those as quickly as possible to get that money back from whoever is financing the car, often through manufacturer financing or dealership financing/ preferred partnerships with lenders. They have more of a vested interest in selling the cars on the lot over ordering another one.

Is that why dealers love special orders that are actual sales?

^ that are actual sales? Why’d everyone stop four words early?

 

[LouG]

I'm a young person and cars are basically my religion lol. With every generation, you've had people who loved cars and driving, and the majority of people who didn't. Back in the day, you didn't have an option, even if you didn't like cars and driving, you still often had to drive to get around. These days, the people who don't want to drive just take an Uber, or rely on public transportation to get around, people like them have always existed, it's just easier to live that way than it used to be.
I think people are mistaking the decline in young people driving for a decline in the love for cars.

My point is, the passion is still there, and if anything, it's getting stronger. Look at how many young people you see sharing and talking about cars on social media for instance. People literally running after cars at events because they want to film and interact with them.

There is a basic difference in that we had to have an interest in cars whether we were petrolheads or not. Cars from the 50's and 60's required a lot of "fettling" to keep them running. Owners had to know how to clean plugs, set ign points, check for spark and fuel.
I remember my Father doing an impromptu tune at 5.00AM as we were setting out on a road trip and the "porca dio" ( his words) wouldn't start.
A vastly different sitution to running after some car trying to video it crashing. Or gathering in a carpark to watch the misguided making tyre compnies much richer.

Those of us who were petrolheads lived for cars, for working on them, driving them, they were our key to freedom. No Ubers, public transport, or electric scooters.
Even when I was nearly 60 I went to the Ferrari museum in Modena, and felt like I was in a holy place.

 

[AzkAdAsh]

^ that are actual sales? Why’d everyone stop four words early?

Again, no. It's not why they love special orders that are actual sales. It's why they love to sell the cars that they already have on the lot.

Special orders come with a lot of risk to the dealership, and when they payoff, the dealership can make a good profit on mark-ups for that order. If they don't, the dealership is left holding the bag. Special orders don't eliminate a car from inventory that they are still paying overhead for. Each car in the inventory that doesn't sell quickly is an expenditure they have to pay, including special orders that fall through. It's a risk that a lot of dealerships don't want to take.

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