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Hack

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So what's the differnce to when you get an hydraulic failure on a classic brake setup?
Obviously no one knows the answer to this question unless they've experienced a failure of the newer type electrical braking system in whichever specific model car we are comparing to. And cars with computerized brakes are relatively new, so we don't know much about them yet.

I've experienced failure of a mechanical hydraulic system in my '70 Mustang. I can tell you about how dramatic and scary it was. So bad that I continued to drive the car for years with the problem. In essence, you could easily feel that the fluid was starting to get low (again) and it was time to refill the master cylinder. That car had junky brakes - in fact it came with drums all around - and it never stopped well. But it was really easy to tell when the brakes started weakening in any way.

Now, I always consider everything from the point of view of my youth. I didn't have much money and I drove ancient vehicles and repaired them (sometimes poorly) myself. Certain things I know will fail in every car, such as electrical grounds. At least in MN once a car is 10 years old or more, grounds are suspect and they will cause quirky failures that come and go at times.

My job is in technology and I do like technology. However that doesn't mean that I believe engineers are infallible. They have a budget for development and testing. They have a budget for the production components. Sometimes a development engineer has to take risks. They realize that a system should get X amount of life and failure testing and they know that it needs Y quality of components. But the project manager doesn't allow enough time and money for either X or Y. So the engineer has to make some educated guesses.

Yeah it's easy to say that someone hates technnology. But just because I prefer to buy a simple car doesn't mean I hate technology. There are just advantages to simplicity. Using technology's "bigger hammer" approach should only be done when significant benefits can be derived.
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9secondko

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First off we have known for quite some time that the S650 was not going to be evolutionary. What you are asking for could be the S750 but who knows as that's a long way off. Secondly you are making assumptions based on camouflaged spy photos. We really do not know what the finished car is going to look like, inside or out. How about waiting to see the actual car before going all doom and gloom on us.

And lastly....


Good luck with that. I'm guessing you want all of the at 3000 lbs. and $40,000. :crackup::like:
thats the hope. And we should expect better by now. The mustang is Fords enthusiast car. It should be given care as such. Instead, it gets “new” platforms that are just extended s197 bones. We’d heard for a long time how s650was going to be all new and really swing for the fences. Instead we get an s197 with a bit more modification than the s550+.

For the failure it was, Chevy went for it with the alpha Camaro. The thing handled and accelerated way above its weight class out of the box. If they could do it, so can cord, who has better engine tech. Instead, ford figures mustang people will buy anything with a pony on it and just enough excitement.

they take an suv, give it modern sports car styling and call it a mustang then promote it to death. It’s a success. Then they take the actual mustang,give it old Dodge Charger styling and tack on some new bitstoa 20 year old platform. The actual mustang gets less love than the suv wearing its name.

my first car was a mustang. Fourth car was a mustang, sixth car was a mustang. But I have t bought one in a long time. Thes550 gt500 was tempting but the price is high and markups are ridiculous.

waiting for the s650 after following the hype and this “same ol stuff’ ’ drops.

bummed. This is t coming from someone who doesnt care. This is a big deal. S650 was talked up and the. It became another compromise.

hopefully they wring serious performance out of the new mustang. Otherwise, the design aesthetic is just too much of a turn off.

I know some will defend it because it’s the mustang. But let’s be real. This is a really bad look. Hopefully ford see the sentiment and changes it pronto.

law for your second comment, who would t “want” that? But I’m realistic and that’s not what I stated. So please don’t try to confuse the issue by feigning someone else’s intent. It’s a disservice the the poster and the community here.
 

Bikeman315

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thats the hope. And we should expect better by now. The mustang is Fords enthusiast car. It should be given care as such.
No disrespect, but I think you really need a reality check. Ford Corporation is being driven by sales of trucks and CUV/SUV's, not a enthusiast car. Honestly if it wasn't for the Mustang name now being used as a "Brand" name and the huge success of the Mach-E we might not even have a S650.

I know some will defend it because it’s the mustang. But let’s be real. This is a really bad look. Hopefully ford see the sentiment and changes it pronto.
This isn't about defense it's about reality ( I know common theme of mine which is ridiculous for an internet forum). The lovers and the haters both have no actual clue what the finished car is going to look like. The lovers are willing to cut the spy photos some slack, the haters, well they hate.

Listen I appreciate what you are saying. I would love these things to. What Mustang owner wouldn't. But it doesn't really matter. At this point we are getting what has been planned. Why do we not just wait until it is introduced before condemning it?

bummed. This is t coming from someone who doesnt care. This is a big deal. S650 was talked up and the. It became another compromise.
The reason the S650 will be an evolution of the S550 and not want we were originally told has a lot to do with Covid, supply chain issues and the overall economy. Not of those things were Ford's ideas.

law for your second comment, who would t “want” that? But I’m realistic and that’s not what I stated. So please don’t try to confuse the issue by feigning someone else’s intent. It’s a disservice the the poster and the community here./QUOTE]
Not 100% exactly what you are trying to say but my last comment had emoji's. It was humor just in case you didn't get it. :facepalm:
 

Stam616

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As much as I’d like otherwise, Ford is clearly just updating the S550 and this is no more a next generation than the 87 was from the 86 Mustang. They will sell this and then phase it out as the Mach-e takes over and will eventually be the only Mustang for the masses. Perhaps the coupe will come back in the mid to late 2030’s as a limited high dollar sports car, but I predict after 2029 at the latest it will be dropped due to “disappointing” sales so the Crossover craze can continue. The ONLY way to change this is to buy more coupes. Seriously. Increase that market and we’ll get the coupe we want. Keep buying SUVs and crossovers and Mustang, Camaro and other coupe names will be slapped on Crossovers and blocky SUV’s.
 

IceGamer

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The reason the S650 will be an evolution of the S550 and not want we were originally told has a lot to do with Covid, supply chain issues and the overall economy. Not of those things were Ford's ideas.
Apart from the statement quoted I liked your post. However, the decision to ‘evolve’ the S550 was made before Covid and all that. As @amk91 has stated several times, S650 was planned for 2020 and should’ve been a ground up new Mustang based on the CD6 platform. (No, it's not a dedicated SUV platform it’s just so flexible that several different cars could’ve been built on it). Unfortunately in 2017 J. Hackett took over and put everything on halt. He favored a CUV/SUV EV over a hybrid Mustang on a new platform and the rest is history.
Writing this hurts as one can only imagine how different the S650 would’ve been (looking at you reduced weight and AWD…).
 


DeluxeStang

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interesting. Well, I’m glad somebody likes it. We will have to agree to disagree. I’m curious what you like about it to call it “upgrades.” It seems a downgrade from a design and aesthetic standpoint. Also curious what you mean by refraining from oversized grilled. The grille onthis looks larger than the current s550. From what we’ve seen so far, it looks like an s550 facelift more so than an s650. Like an s555 or something. Hopefully the rest of the car fares better. At least the front fascia appears to have less overhang. That’s a plus. Really hoping this is is adesign candidate and not the final direction.
Trust in Jem, based on what he's said, it seems like when he initially saw the design, he was underwhelmed. But his comments imply he's come around. He's the only one on this site who's seen the s650's entire design (that we know of). If he says it looks great, who are we to doubt him, none of us have seen the design in it's entirety.
 
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DeluxeStang

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Apart from the statement quoted I liked your post. However, the decision to ‘evolve’ the S550 was made before Covid and all that. As @amk91 has stated several times, S650 was planned for 2020 and should’ve been a ground up new Mustang based on the CD6 platform. (No, it's not a dedicated SUV platform it’s just so flexible that several different cars could’ve been built on it). Unfortunately in 2017 J. Hackett took over and put everything on halt. He favored a CUV/SUV EV over a hybrid Mustang on a new platform and the rest is history.
Writing this hurts as one can only imagine how different the S650 would’ve been (looking at you reduced weight and AWD…).
Insiders said the cd6 mustang would have been larger and heavier than the s550.
 

IceGamer

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Insiders said the cd6 mustang would have been larger and heavier than the s550.
Maybe but they also say that the S650 would've challenged the Challenger and would've tried to be a 'real' muscle car over a Pony ;)
Anyhow, I just mentioned those things as I don't expect the S650 to loose any significant amount of weight without structural changes and as we know, those won't happen...
 

Bikeman315

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Apart from the statement quoted I liked your post. However, the decision to ‘evolve’ the S550 was made before Covid and all that. As @amk91 has stated several times, S650 was planned for 2020 and should’ve been a ground up new Mustang based on the CD6 platform. (No, it's not a dedicated SUV platform it’s just so flexible that several different cars could’ve been built on it). Unfortunately in 2017 J. Hackett took over and put everything on halt. He favored a CUV/SUV EV over a hybrid Mustang on a new platform and the rest is history.
Writing this hurts as one can only imagine how different the S650 would’ve been (looking at you reduced weight and AWD…).
Thank you @IceGamer, I got that wrong. The memory isn’t what is used to be. :like:

That said, no complaining here is going to change the S650. With the uncertainly of what the S750 could be (V8, Hybird, EV, AWD, etc.) The S650 could be our last best chance to get a “real” V8 Mustang.
 

Jem

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Trust in Jem, based on what he's said, it seems like when he initially saw the design, he was underwhelmed. But his comments imply he's come around. He's the only one on this site who's seen the s650's entire design (that we know of). If he says it looks great, who are we to doubt him, none of us have seen the design in it's entirety.
Im still underwhelmed in that i wish is was more a departure from s550.

I'm not saying its ugly, nothing of the sort. Imo it's not, it will be seen as very good looking im sure, by many.

Interior im not a fan of. I wish they kept elements that give it identity. There isn't much in the way of mustang identity other than a horse on the wheel. They should have stuck to round hvac vents, flick switches etc something to tie us back.

Will i get one, undecided. 😬
 

Ruin

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I'm not saying its ugly, nothing of the sort. Imo it's not, it will be seen as very good looking im sure, by many.

Interior im not a fan of. I wish they kept elements that give it identity. There isn't much in the way of mustang identity other than a horse on the wheel. They should have stuck to round hvac vents, flick switches etc something to tie us back.
I’ve been waiting for this kind of comment from someone whose seen it - an “honest no BS assessment” as Harry Stamper said. It highlights the problem I had with Mustang until the S550. The exteriors are typically very good looking, but the interiors tend to be pretty “meh.” I have no doubt the 650 will look cool at car shows and driving down the road, but that’s not how I enjoy my car as an owner. 100% of my driving experience is inside the car, not looking at it.

I was hoping the 650 would be further advancement in what a Mustang’s interior is like in the 21st century (the 550’s interior is the best interior in a Mustang ever IMO) and for the ever increasing price point. I fear the lack of a “wow” interior in the future will push me out of a Mustang altogether when it’s time for a new car in years.

That’s a bummer, but I understand why they wanted to catch the “80s were cool” trend and throwback to the Fox interior. I just don’t like it *for me.* But… but… this will continue to push the Mustang forward as the icon brand, hopefully, grows to include some more premium touches. And I hope and assume Ford is listening.

Thanks for the insight Jem! You just eliminated all doubt in my mind about this order and I’m fully entrenched in the “wait and see” camp for the 650 now. 🍺

OK, that’s fair. But why don’t we wait until seeing the real car before passing judgement?
In my case, it’s because the spy shots offer enough of a finished product to know that no refinement will change my mind on how I feel about that interior. Not only does it do nothing for me, I actively dislike it. Nothing about the exterior will change that for me on a $50k+ purchase.


{eta: multi-quote fail}
 

Cobra Jet

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OK, that’s fair. But why don’t we wait until seeing the real car before passing judgement?
On a discussion level -

How much more "real" can the car get - the photos posted of the exterior and interior are IT. There's not going to be any major developments or changes at this stage. The hardware and physical elements that make up the exterior and interior are done. The contractors assigned to making what we see aren't going to "change" anything at this stage - not as far as the molds for interior components or exterior molded nose/rear cones and associated parts.. Design elements as far as the final finishes and colors - sure. What we see at this stage is IT.

That steering wheel center is atrocious - it's a truck wheel stuffed into a car interior - as are the other components making up the dash.

I'm not seeing how "judgement" can't be passed at this stage in the game - not when what we see from the actual "leaked" photos is pretty much finalized.

Have fun with that Fox/KITT/Truck interior mish-mosh.

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