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Rocketman

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Mustangs already compete with European sports cars as is. The Mustang never competed with the little go-kart cars like the Miata or BRZ. Very few mustangs were actually "good handling" cars. SN95s, and newer are about as good as your going to get in a Mustang when it comes to handling except maybe a 65-66GT350. As a car that currently rates 2nd place in the 3-way muscle car wars, with the Camaro about to die again, the Mustang will still take the crown even as it sits weight wise and center of gravity wise. Also the Barra 325-T 4.0L inline six fits perfectly under the production hood of a GT350 so it wouldn't be an issue. An I-6TT fits under the sloping hood of an M4 or M3 so it would work fine in the Mustang and the Mustang originally came with an I-6 from the factory in the 60's so it would still be fine within the specs of "Mustang" And your thoughts of an AWD system throwing off the center of gravity makes no sense when nearly every Audi performance vehicle has an AWD system, so do alot of Porsches, every new GTR from 2008+ and now the M3/M4 and alot of them will hand a mustang a healthy beating in just about every single scenario all without a v8. Don't get me wrong I love the sound of a V8 engine and the feel of one as well but Ford needs to get with the times. Sure a small 4.0L v8 twin turbo or 4.0L twin turbo Hybrid V8 would be awesome under the hood of a mustang with an AWD system in several different body types. But if the Mustang is to survive, it needs to not be pigeon holed because if it does, it will die out just like the Camaro. Having a mustang family would allow the vehicle, and the name, to live on.
Not sure why Ford would ever spend the resources on developing a new I6 when there is a perfectly good 2.7/3.5 that works well for the Mustang.

I do think that the Mustang will be offered with AWD, but only in a hybrid engine configuration. I also see the 5.0 soldiering on as the same 480hp motor from the Bullit/Mach 1 but with very little development happening throughout that generation until it finally disappears for the S750.
 

IceGamer

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Mustangs already compete with European sports cars as is. The Mustang never competed with the little go-kart cars like the Miata or BRZ. Very few mustangs were actually "good handling" cars. SN95s, and newer are about as good as your going to get in a Mustang when it comes to handling except maybe a 65-66GT350. As a car that currently rates 2nd place in the 3-way muscle car wars, with the Camaro about to die again, the Mustang will still take the crown even as it sits weight wise and center of gravity wise. Also the Barra 325-T 4.0L inline six fits perfectly under the production hood of a GT350 so it wouldn't be an issue. An I-6TT fits under the sloping hood of an M4 or M3 so it would work fine in the Mustang and the Mustang originally came with an I-6 from the factory in the 60's so it would still be fine within the specs of "Mustang" And your thoughts of an AWD system throwing off the center of gravity makes no sense when nearly every Audi performance vehicle has an AWD system, so do alot of Porsches, every new GTR from 2008+ and now the M3/M4 and alot of them will hand a mustang a healthy beating in just about every single scenario all without a v8. Don't get me wrong I love the sound of a V8 engine and the feel of one as well but Ford needs to get with the times. Sure a small 4.0L v8 twin turbo or 4.0L twin turbo Hybrid V8 would be awesome under the hood of a mustang with an AWD system in several different body types. But if the Mustang is to survive, it needs to not be pigeon holed because if it does, it will die out just like the Camaro. Having a mustang family would allow the vehicle, and the name, to live on.
I strongly disagree. The Mustang is a GT not a race car and therefore it’s not a shame when other might beat it. People who buy a Mustang do so because of the V8 at least here in Europe they do. Is a RS4 faster? Yes it is. Is the new BMW M3/M4 faster? Yes, way faster. So what? There will always be someone faster than you so who cares? If performance is the only thing that’s relevant full electric cars are the way go to anyways.
GT means it made for long range, cruising around, enjoying the lovely V8 sound and occasionally being able to drive fast. The new C63 AMG will be a 4 cyl. hybrid that will most certainly be faster than a GT350. Would you rather have a super-fast car that has almost no character or a V8 that might be a tad slow? I know my answer…
Again, the Mustang GT is not a track car although some people use it as such. But most who do customize their cars…. Rear seat delete, supercharger, new cooling systems and so on.

As @Twin Turbo already expressed: here are some “unusual visions being expressed …” I don’t mind you offering your vision of a future Mustang and I hope that if Ford can afford it they might eventually consider some of your proposals. However, I think a V8 should be first in line.
 

Hack

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Mustangs already compete with European sports cars as is. The Mustang never competed with the little go-kart cars like the Miata or BRZ. Very few mustangs were actually "good handling" cars. SN95s, and newer are about as good as your going to get in a Mustang when it comes to handling except maybe a 65-66GT350. As a car that currently rates 2nd place in the 3-way muscle car wars, with the Camaro about to die again, the Mustang will still take the crown even as it sits weight wise and center of gravity wise. Also the Barra 325-T 4.0L inline six fits perfectly under the production hood of a GT350 so it wouldn't be an issue. An I-6TT fits under the sloping hood of an M4 or M3 so it would work fine in the Mustang and the Mustang originally came with an I-6 from the factory in the 60's so it would still be fine within the specs of "Mustang" And your thoughts of an AWD system throwing off the center of gravity makes no sense when nearly every Audi performance vehicle has an AWD system, so do alot of Porsches, every new GTR from 2008+ and now the M3/M4 and alot of them will hand a mustang a healthy beating in just about every single scenario all without a v8. Don't get me wrong I love the sound of a V8 engine and the feel of one as well but Ford needs to get with the times. Sure a small 4.0L v8 twin turbo or 4.0L twin turbo Hybrid V8 would be awesome under the hood of a mustang with an AWD system in several different body types. But if the Mustang is to survive, it needs to not be pigeon holed because if it does, it will die out just like the Camaro. Having a mustang family would allow the vehicle, and the name, to live on.
I didn't say anything about handling, I just mentioned sporty, inexpensive cars that Mustang should be competing with. But now that you mention it, Mustang is a good handling car now that it has an IRS. If the Mustang is going to turn into an SUV it might as well get the stick axle back.

You can say it makes no sense that adding objects like an AWD system that have to fit under the engine will throw off the CoG of the car, but that doesn't change the fact that AWD will create a need to raise the engine higher in the chassis. Two objects can't occupy the same space. It's as simple as that.

The Barra is about the same height as a Coyote, but it's about 6 inches longer. That's why other companies tilt their straight 6s over - to improve packaging. The Barra is designed more for a truck or SUV rather than a sporty vehicle. I'd much rather have a V10 over a straight 6 in the Mustang. But Ford already wants too much money for a small displacement V8. Imagine what they would charge for a 6.0 V10.

Not sure why Ford would ever spend the resources on developing a new I6 when there is a perfectly good 2.7/3.5 that works well for the Mustang.

I do think that the Mustang will be offered with AWD, but only in a hybrid engine configuration. I also see the 5.0 soldiering on as the same 480hp motor from the Bullit/Mach 1 but with very little development happening throughout that generation until it finally disappears for the S750.
Good point. I realized that after I posted. Ford would use a V6 if they did a 6 cylinder in the Mustang. And you are probably right about the 5.0. If the Mustang is redesigned to have a battery pack in the floor with the hood raised for the AWD system, the 5.0 will still fit under the hood no problem.
 

3ZERO3

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I love my S550 and plan to have it until I die.
With that said, I always look forward to design changes and appreciate info from you guys who are in the know.
Hopefully it will still look good sitting in your (and My) garage. Ceratin global governments are talking about outlawing NEW ice vehicles in the next 10 years, it's only a matter of 10 years or so after that which they will tax you into not driving ANY ice powered vehicle. Synthetic fuel could be a saving grace but by the looks of it, you're in Oregon so I wish you the best of luck.
 

Troutwrangler

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Hopefully it will still look good sitting in your (and My) garage. Ceratin global governments are talking about outlawing NEW ice vehicles in the next 10 years, it's only a matter of 10 years or so after that which they will tax you into not driving ANY ice powered vehicle. Synthetic fuel could be a saving grace but by the looks of it, you're in Oregon so I wish you the best of luck.
Exactly! I'm going to enjoy the 5.0 as long as I can...😁

Oregon is so Communist.
We will be the last place on earth to be free of these stupid masks and one of the first to outlaw ICE vehicles....

You hit the nail on the head saying that "they will tax you into not driving any Ice powered vehicle".
Comrade Kate Brown and her insane clown posse (no offense intended toward the music group) running our state are slobbering drunk to tax our gasoline consumption even worse than it is right now.

Fortunately, I live East of the Cascades where cowboys and loggers still outnumber politicians and there are a lot of isolated places to bury bodies. With that said, a lot of the bullshit happening in Salem affects us too.

Sorry to rant....I'm done now....
 

docshelby

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Some rather......er.....unusual visions being expressed here. Lets keep the non-Fastback/convertible talk to the other active threads.

Me? I'm a traditionalist when it comes to the Mustang, so I'm happy to keep the same recipe we've have for almost 57 years. Keep it a relatively simple 2+2 Fastback/convertible with a choice of powertrains, including a V8. Make it a great looking car people aspire to owning.

Fortunately, at least for the traditional Mustang we know and love, it seems they won't deviate too much from the S550 recipe with S650. Given what we know, expect something like the change from the '09 to '10 S197.
Yeah, I liked the 05-09 version better. They just keep getting bigger and bigger! Need to go smaller! Mark my words they're going to mess it up!
 

3ZERO3

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Exactly! I'm going to enjoy the 5.0 as long as I can...😁

Oregon is so Communist.
We will be the last place on earth to be free of these stupid masks and one of the first to outlaw ICE vehicles....

You hit the nail on the head saying that "they will tax you into not driving any Ice powered vehicle".
Comrade Kate Brown and her insane clown posse (no offense intended toward the music group) running our state are slobbering drunk to tax our gasoline consumption even worse than it is right now.

Fortunately, I live East of the Cascades where cowboys and loggers still outnumber politicians and there are a lot of isolated places to bury bodies. With that said, a lot of the bullshit happening in Salem affects us too.

Sorry to rant....I'm done now....
Thats really the key to all this. They can't just come out and ban existing ICE cars without a ton of backlash but they CAN increase the license, registration and fuel tax by a few hundred + percent. Without getting into politics too much, Oregon really is a (hold my beer and watch this) political game right now. Don't worry too much though, you could technnically be living in "Greater Idaho" soon.
 
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Troutwrangler

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Thats really the key to all this. They can't just come out and ban existing ICE cars without a ton of backlash but they CAN increase the license, registration and fuel tax by a few hundred + percent. Without getting into politics too much, Oregon really is a (hold my beer and watch this) political game right now. Don't worry too much though, you could technnically be living in "Greater Idaho" soon.
Correct-
A buddy of mine is the guy who started the "Greater Idaho" idea....
He is retired and it started out as a curiosity of his if anyone would be interested....
I doubt it will ever go anywhere, but if nothing else, he is making a statement about Oregon government.
I will be on the very Northwest edge of the "new state" 😁

I am concerned that Boise is growing so fast that it will be a new 'Portland" soon.
Hopefully I'm wrong, and there's nothing I can do about it, but I hate to see it.

You are correct about Oregon being a political game right now.
The unchallenged, one party state government is sneaking in so many "back door" taxes and fees right now that it will make your head spin.... New taxes on big corporations that regular citizens don't see first hand, but everywhere we spend money, the corporation ends up "paying the tax" for us on our purchases.
I'm surprised that our auto registration fees are still inexpensive compared to most other places. They are going up all the time, though, so will catch up with everyone else soon I'm sure.
 

sigintel

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So regarding the incremental styling/language evolution, uhhh I amhoping these images below are how NOT to do it. Last i heard Franz isnt sleeping well after mixing “incremental” with Berlin MDMA and things got out of the teams control...
Confident Ford can out class these aesthetics:
5664FD5D-EF24-47BF-AB3A-F8198EBAA56B.jpeg
BAA6CB71-1B57-4D17-98E9-A0527C8CA1C5.jpeg
341F5F4D-689E-499A-9EFB-E9A80716736D.jpeg

surely S650 will be less.. uh.. ehhh...

My favorite fox body:
5FDCBC38-A97C-4913-ABE5-F4233A7275D7.jpeg
 
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NoVaGT

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Design-wise, which is what really sells vehicles, Ford has had an amazing run with the Mustang since 2005.

To be objective, they're due for a dud design, and the S650 might be it.
 

Twin Turbo

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One thing I can guarantee..........there will be multiple threads on how "the S650 doesn't look like a Mustang".....or "it's ugly".......or "it looks like a Fusion/Focus/insert other name here".

It happens with every refresh and every new generation. Many......not all.......but many, will soon change their minds once they see the car in the flesh.

I'm sure Aiden Chang-il Lee has pretty much completed the design of S650, but I wish him luck all the same. There are about 10 million Mustang fans prepared to let him know if he's done a good job or not :giggle:
 

MikeyV

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So regarding the incremental styling/language evolution, uhhh I amhoping these images below are how NOT to do it. Last i heard Franz isnt sleeping well after mixing “incremental” with Berlin MDMA and things got out of the teams control...
Confident Ford can out class these aesthetics:
5664FD5D-EF24-47BF-AB3A-F8198EBAA56B.jpeg
BAA6CB71-1B57-4D17-98E9-A0527C8CA1C5.jpeg
341F5F4D-689E-499A-9EFB-E9A80716736D.jpeg

surely S650 will be less.. uh.. ehhh...

My favorite fox body:
5FDCBC38-A97C-4913-ABE5-F4233A7275D7.jpeg
I think that new BMW M3/M4 look is f'kin RAD. Love it. This is hwo big Ford needs to go here. This incremental BS on top of a "vintage inspired" design is played out. Dodge is retro, Chevy retro, Ford Retro. Who's gonna go big here and take the spotlight?

I always remember something that Chris Bangle said in an interview. He was the guy who changed the look of the BMW 7 series (notable) and took mad shit for it. I liked his designs, and now, the newest 7 series is trying to copy his style from 20 years ago.

Whether you like his stuff or not, he said, something to the effect "If a consumer sees a brand new design for a car and accepts it, then it's already an old design." He accepts it because it's what he's already been accustomed to. If it's new and bold enough, it will shock people at first.

It makes me think of the '71 Mustangs. To me, those held up the best to a modern eye. At least for me. '69 and '70s look old, like a '65 looks old. The 71s were new, different, crazy and bold and some liked it, some didn't. But here, fifty years later, for me at least, those are the best.

And comparing a current Mustang to an old one, they look closest to a 71-73..so...

I hope Ford puts as much effort into this next gen as the did with that stupid electrick minivan they're spamming me with.
 

sigintel

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I think that new BMW M3/M4 look is f'kin RAD. Love it. This is hwo big Ford needs to go here.
Really? Have you seen either the concept and production in person? Are you saying you ordered one? I simply dont believe you would spend your money on this. How could anyone that finds a 2014 GT good looking think that the new M3/4 looks good? Your taste in cars is too mature for this M disaster.

Domagoj Dukec aint sleeping well. God bless him for trying, but he could not get the concept into production and should have resigned in protest.

I am hearing from owners of BMWs that the proportions and aesthetics are stressful to experience.
Study the car show concept vs the production version.
BMW design has been in disaster mode past couple months and aftermarket already has several companies producing replacement front bumpers for BRAND NEW CARS. Prior Design is sold out unless you prepay for their M3/M4 replacement bumpers.
PRIOR Design GmbH
Carl-Friedrich-Gauss-Str. 64
47475 Kamp-Lintfort
Call: +49 2842 9757 00
Email: [email protected]

https://www.google.com/search?&q=M3+M4+design+fucked&oq=M3+M4+design+fucked

Breaking the continuous lateral curve linear theme across the upper front end was a detraction in the concept and when exacerbated was kiss of death for the production version.

Concept:
BMW-Concept-4-Series-3-1.jpg

https://cdn.bmwblog.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/09/BMW-Concept-4-Series-3-1.jpg

BMW-Concept-4-Series-4-1.jpg

https://cdn.bmwblog.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/09/BMW-Concept-4-Series-4-1.jpg

At the show my gf was like "what are you starring at?" I said "heart shaped", and got slapped before I could finish the thought. She thought it was nice to look at too...
BMW-Concept-4-Series-7.jpg

https://cdn.bmwblog.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/09/BMW-Concept-4-Series-7.jpg

 

Sc00ter

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Interesting... an ex-GM designer now head designer of the Mustang. Considering GM’s designs in the past 10 years or so and the current theme of automotive design, makes me think the next Gen Mustang might not be quite the looker than the S550 is
Ouch! I hate to say it, but you may be right. I always look back at my 2015 and think it's beautiful from every angle: a new Camaro, never.(bad ass, maybe... but never good looking)
 
 
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