Is it me or is this car tail happy when making fast turns

[COBill]

Emboldening mine:

The why is simply the fact most driver's reactions to skids is to incorrectly steer and/or brake into them resulting in the inevitable ditching! After all, we're not all Jimmy Stewarts, me included!

Jackie Stewart, or James (Jimmy) Stewart, the actor in It's a Wonderful Life?

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[Alan Applegate]

You're correct, it is Jackie.

I actually met him a couple of times at Bonderant's driving school. One was a free trip when I signed up for campaigning a Merkur in Group 2. Lordy, that was forty years ago!

While we're on racing the Merkur... The Merkur was almost an ideal racing vehicle, as the split was nearly 50/50. It did have four wheel independent suspension, but was far from tail happy. The only way to get there was to install a heavier rear torsion bar, than normally supplied with a Eibach after-market suspension. The point here is, swinging the tail is almost a necessity when road racing, but only to a point. Thankfully the Merkur was sans pre-lawyer electronics!

 

[bountifulgoose]

These mustang are actually very stable your punching the throttle from a stop to make a turn or u turn of course your gonna break the tires loose lol. Pull that crap in a high hp fwd car and the front wheels will break loose. About the only car you can pull that in is gonna be awd. Take it slow and really practice. Personally the only time I broke the rear loose on a turn was because I was going fast and the happened to be a patch of sand that one of my tires caught mid turn, wasnt hard to correct though. Other than that I have driven in the rain several times even drove through the snow for a couple hours once never had an issue. Also you said the tires weren't cold because it was 70 degrees lol, bro go by your fricken tire pressure. If the air in your tires has not expanded yet a few psi to the pressure they typically get after you have driven for a bit, then they are still cold.

 

[BamasGT]

Is it me or will the back of the car try to come around when you take a turn under throttle?

One time I punched it taking a left turn, more of a sweeping left turn from a stop and the tires lit up and not in a gentle way

The second time I was making a U turn, ok my bad too much throttle as I came out of it but they spun and again, not in a gentle way and no traction control intervention

This morning, the roads might have had a little water on them, not much as it was a busy intersection but I was in a hurry and hooked a right turn at 40 ish from the right lane, into the left lane of the other road and about half way thru the turn and I'll admit I was in a hurry, I could feel the back end sliding so I let off on it before it could get tail happy or try to come around.

It is not cold tires as t was 70 degrees plus each time

Or maybe it is just like every other mustang I have ever driven , tail happy

Kinda sound like you are not used to RWD. Did you come from a FWD vehicle?

 

[tktrain]

The Torsen differential is particularly good at bringing the rear around. I gave my new DH a bit too much throttle turning left off my street onto another. I got about 30° out and backed off. Fortunately, the car straightened back up and no damage was done.

I had a old Fox body years ago that I had put a narrowed 9" with a Detroit locker in. Now that was damn near dangerous on ice and snow. I popped over a hill and there was a school bus up ahead. I hit the brakes, and before I knew what happened I was 180° and slid into a chain link fence.

 

[Dave2013M3]

I see YouTube in your future...under Mustangs wrecking. I found the Mustangs rearend very stable. You have to drive pretty hamfisted to get it to misbehave. From what you are doing, its in that catagory. From my High Performance driving classes I have taken at DE's, the throttle should be treated with gentleness in a corner.

 

[rbuike]

It is not cold tires as t was 70 degrees plus each time

70 degree air temperature doesn't mean the tires aren't cold

 

[LouG]

Is it me or will the back of the car try to come around when you take a turn under throttle?

One time I punched it taking a left turn, more of a sweeping left turn from a stop and the tires lit up and not in a gentle way

The second time I was making a U turn, ok my bad too much throttle as I came out of it but they spun and again, not in a gentle way and no traction control intervention

This morning, the roads might have had a little water on them, not much as it was a busy intersection but I was in a hurry and hooked a right turn at 40 ish from the right lane, into the left lane of the other road and about half way thru the turn and I'll admit I was in a hurry, I could feel the back end sliding so I let off on it before it could get tail happy or try to come around.

It is not cold tires as t was 70 degrees plus each time

Or maybe it is just like every other mustang I have ever driven , tail happy

Next time, try a gentle slap instead of a punch.

 

[LouG]

The why is simply the fact most driver's reactions to skids is to incorrectly steer and/or brake into them resulting in the inevitable ditching! After all, we're not all Jimmy Stewarts, me included!

Countersteering is the way to control oversteer. It's what's taught in advanced driver training and, it's what I've done since I first got cars going sideways in the 60's. It works.
I'd agree braking is not what you do, nor is accelerating.
What do you suggest for oversteer corection?

 

[LouG]

The point here is, swinging the tail is almost a necessity when road racing, but only to a point. Thankfully the Merkur was sans pre-lawyer electronics!

Not getting at you, but I disagree here too.
Having the rear actually slide on corner exit limits your drive onto the straight, The tyres have exceeded their traction limit and won't take further throttle input.
What is needed on corner entry is rotation or rear yaw to accelerate the turning movement and enabling you to accelerate harder as the corner opens out.
Also called slow in, fast out or squaring the corner

 

[Alan Applegate]

You can go to a decent driving school; or drive a few thousand mountain miles; and a few dozen other things too. But... The only way to really get good on the track is to drive on the track. Saying something like... Oh you lift in, and drive hard out. Really? That works of course, but it is not a universal remedy. Imagine coming to a left bender, only to find the entry soon drops off sharply just about the time you start to power through! Oh, and that switch back maneuver which worked so well on the last track, becomes a hay bailer on this one. It all boils down to experience. Unfortunately, you still hit the bails, or worse, the hard wall. I've done both more than once. It is a darn miracle I've lived this long!

 

[POHLHAMMER]

Eh, kinda , the IRS isn’t nearly as tail happy as the solid axles were.

I will say, let out early, the drive by wire seems to keep the throttle open a few milliseconds after, don’t want to see anyone have trouble

I Drive trucks for 30 yrs. Grew up on Atvs , dirt bikes , Sleds, Motorcycles, you name it. Kicking them sideways every turn , everywhere. So I understand physics offroad very well.


I did a burn out in my dad's driveway , and I am completely novice to sport cars. So I am just getting the feel of pavement and way more weight.
When I did the Mustang seemed to stay powered well after I let off. It got me a little bit more sideways than I wanted , and humbled me quickly. I immediately thought to myself this car didn't listen to my lifting when I asked it to. I am aware there is more drivetrain spinning , and its not going to be like a dirt bike. I was just thrown off by the big delay more than expected.

I appreciate your comment, as I was worried it was all me and maybe I shouldn't #uck around. I think I just need a bigger area to figure it out

 

[Upacurb]

I Drive trucks for 30 yrs. Grew up on Atvs , dirt bikes , Sleds, Motorcycles, you name it. Kicking them sideways every turn , everywhere. So I understand physics offroad very well.


I did a burn out in my dad's driveway , and I am completely novice to sport cars. So I am just getting the feel of pavement and way more weight.
When I did the Mustang seemed to stay powered well after I let off. It got me a little bit more sideways than I wanted , and humbled me quickly. I immediately thought to myself this car didn't listen to my lifting when I asked it to. I am aware there is more drivetrain spinning , and its not going to be like a dirt bike. I was just thrown off by the big delay more than expected.

I appreciate your comment, as I was worried it was all me and maybe I shouldn't #uck around. I think I just need a bigger area to figure it out

that’s how I initially did it … big open parking lot … have fun

 

[LouG]

You can go to a decent driving school; or drive a few thousand mountain miles; and a few dozen other things too. But... The only way to really get good on the track is to drive on the track. Saying something like... Oh you lift in, and drive hard out. Really? That works of course, but it is not a universal remedy. Imagine coming to a left bender, only to find the entry soon drops off sharply just about the time you start to power through! Oh, and that switch back maneuver which worked so well on the last track, becomes a hay bailer on this one. It all boils down to experience. Unfortunately, you still hit the bails, or worse, the hard wall. I've done both more than once. It is a darn miracle I've lived this long!

I have done track days on cars and bikes. Lots of fast car and bike road driving on some of the more challenging roads you'll find anywhere and something very few people get to do, very fast and legal driving amongst normal traffic, as in up to double the limit or more.
I'm no expert, but I have a sh*t ton of experience.
Miracles happened here too. But you can reduce the need for miracles.

 

[Paul's stable]

You're correct, it is Jackie.

I actually met him a couple of times at Bonderant's driving school. One was a free trip when I signed up for campaigning a Merkur in Group 2. Lordy, that was forty years ago!

While we're on racing the Merkur... The Merkur was almost an ideal racing vehicle, as the split was nearly 50/50. It did have four wheel independent suspension, but was far from tail happy. The only way to get there was to install a heavier rear torsion bar, than normally supplied with a Eibach after-market suspension. The point here is, swinging the tail is almost a necessity when road racing, but only to a point. Thankfully the Merkur was sans pre-lawyer electronics!

Merkur I remember those. back in the 80's my best friend took his girlfriend of 6 years down to California she ended up going on the price is right and she won a car. She took the money came home went out to buy a Merkur and she hooked up with the car salesman and left him. Best thing to happen to him.

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