GTD Weight Revealed

[RLE55]

The 4300+ weight has to be a mistake

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[robvas]

Remember when the S500 GT500 curb weight was leaked it was almost 100lbs heavier than actual...

https://www.mustang6g.com/forums/th...0-ft-lbs-4500-rpm-4225lbs-curb-weight.108893/

 

[Katastrophe]

Not to bring other cars into this, but the ND Miata is roughly 200lbs heavier than the NA...

For those who aren't savvy on the generations...that's a 1990 model compared to a 2025.

That translates to a 10% weight increase with literally 60% more power...over THIRTY FIVE years. Impressive.

I don't think anyone expects the modern Mustang to be a lightweight, sub-3000lb car...but having a dedicated chassis and weighing two tons just ain't it...

 

[9secondko]

Not to bring other cars into this, but the ND Miata is roughly 200lbs heavier than the NA...

For those who aren't savvy on the generations...that's a 1990 model compared to a 2025.

That translates to a 10% weight increase with literally 60% more power...over THIRTY FIVE years. Impressive.

I don't think anyone expects the modern Mustang to be a lightweight, sub-3000lb car...but having a dedicated chassis and weighing two tons just ain't it...

A Mustang should never weight 2 tons.

A mustang with all the performance goodies, forced induction, etc. should be around 3600 max.

The Gtd could have easily done that or lighter if they actually used a dedicated chassis. They didn’t. It’s a regular mustang. Suspension is mounted in the same locations.

Gonna take a new platform purpose built to be light and tight.

At some point, it doesn’t matter how many spoilers you add, how wide the tires are, or how reactive the shocks… physics is physics.

The gt3rs is absurdly light compared to the Gtd. Bevause Porsche cared from the ground up. It’s not a super expensive car for them to make either. But it makes a big profit bevause it more than backs up its hype.

A mustang s650 chassis weighing over 1,000 lbs more isn’t going to be doing a whole lot about that.

Also, I’d hate to be the one paying that tire bill. You know the thing is going to eat tires like no tomorrow.

 

[Katastrophe]

A Mustang should never weight 2 tons.

A mustang with all the performance goodies, forced induction, etc. should be around 3600 max.

The Gtd could have easily done that or lighter if they actually used a dedicated chassis. They didn’t. It’s a regular mustang. Suspension is mounted in the same locations.

Gonna take a new platform purpose built to be light and tight.

It's a compound issue, too, right? When a vehicle gets more powerful, it requires beefed up cooling, suspension, brakes, drivetrain, etc...which all add even more weight. They're going to have to find a better balance or risk turning it into the Challenger...

EDIT: Just to touch on your tire comment as well: many tests (including C&D's upcoming LL 2025) just do one-lap wonders. Glorified time attacks, basically. I'm never going to bad mouth these tests, because I find them entertaining as hell, but the difference between "qualifying" pace (1 lap) and race pace (even as little as 5 laps) is so overlooked when people compare "track" cars, it's not even funny.

 

[Q6543]

Although I expected it to be lighter… even in a tiny ass foxbody… they’re 33-3400 lbs..

everyone just hears/ knows about the fully gutted, tubular front half car with lexan that weighs 2400 lbs..

I was surprised when my 24 only weighed 3720.

the mustang isn’t ever getting lighter and staying road legal… it’s dark horse R/GT3 or nothing..

all this has made me even more of a McLaren and Porsche fan… they find a way… but at a price.
What the ZR1 (breaking all these records) weigh? It maybe 4K plus too…

 

[9secondko]

It's a compound issue, too, right? When a vehicle gets more powerful, it requires beefed up cooling, suspension, brakes, drivetrain, etc...which all add even more weight. They're going to have to find a better balance or risk turning it into the Challenger...

EDIT: Just to touch on your tire comment as well: many tests (including C&D's upcoming LL 2025) just do one-lap wonders. Glorified time attacks, basically. I'm never going to bad mouth these tests, because I find them entertaining as hell, but the difference between "qualifying" pace (1 lap) and race pace (even as little as 5 laps) is so overlooked when people compare "track" cars, it's not even funny.

Only to a degree. Right?

Sure it requires beefed up cooling and suspension. But not 4000 lbs worth.

That’s why I said it would end up around 3600. Even thst is way heavy for what the mustang shoukd be naturally aspirated in this era.

But either way all the performance goods, it shoukd be right around 3600.

The s650 is just too inefficient to allow for thst.

Hence the call for a new platform either such considerations thought through. We are still working with the old d2c here.

Fully agreed on track tests. Need standardized multi-lap times with “state of the car” afterward - tires, temps, etc. most who track their car would really benefit.

 

[Mustang1987]

They may be able to knock a little weight off the next generation mustang, but the c8 weighs 3600lbs and is made of aluminum and carbon fiber and the base car is about $70k. The base mustang has to start in the low $30Ks so it's a bit restricted.

And there are no rear seats in the c8.

I think the upgrades next generation will be more in the footprint like a lower height etc.

 

[9secondko]

They may be able to knock a little weight off the next generation mustang, but the c8 weighs 3600lbs and is made of aluminum and carbon fiber and the base car is about $70k. The base mustang has to start in the low $30Ks so it's a bit restricted.

And there are no rear seats in the c8.

I think the upgrades next generation will be more in the footprint like a lower height etc.

The base car is around 3550 and doesn’t come with any meaningful carbon fiber. But this base car is well equipped.

The Camaro zl11le is 3837 lbs. That’s supercharged, additional cooling,upgraded suspension,etc.

A twin turbo car with 50-50 weight distribution can do better.

The mustang needs a new lighter, tighter platform.

 

[Katastrophe]

I'm going into the weeds with this one...BUT...

Let's look at GT3 class racing cars. The Mustang GT3 just took 1st and 3rd at Daytona a few weeks back. That car has to fit both the power and weight limits of GT3...which according to Wikipedia is between 500 - 600hp and 2640 - 2860lbs.

The Mustang GT3 has 550hp and weighs 2836lbs, again, according to Wiki. I'm not sure if those numbers are adjusted with BOP, etc...but hey, it's all the info I have right now. The power isn't important, but the weight is. Of note, the Porsche GT3 R also needs to fit that criteria. That car would likely be at the lower end of the spectrum for both power and weight (I can't find the exact stats) with a very close power/weight ratio. Now the interesting thing is the delta between the street car and the race car.

The Porsche GT3 road car is around 3,150lbs with the race car being NO LIGHTER than 2,640lbs. That's a difference of 510lbs give or take depending on trim/transmission. When buying a GT3 (let's not even talk about the crazy RS) road car, you are TRULY getting a race car for the road.

The Mustang GTD road car, IF ACCURATE, at 4300+ pounds is a whopping 1,500lbs heavier than the race car. That delta is absolutely bonkers. The supercharged engine definitely contributes to that increase, but good LORD...where the hell does everything else come from? Did they accidently build the car out of Tungsten? Keep in mind, we're not talking about a GT or DH here...this is a $300k+ bespoke monster for the lucky few.

When speculations for this car were released way back when, I originally thought it would follow the Porsche approach: lightweight, LEAN AND MEAN, but with a naturally aspirated V8 of 5.2 or 5.4L of displacement (I was clearly dead wrong, lol). Given the same delta vs the Porsche example above, that would be like having a GTD that weighs roughly 3,400lbs with 600hp of NA delight.

Anyway, it's not like I have any stock in any of this...I just find it quite interesting.

EDIT: To be clear, I'm actually somewhat OK with where the weights are for the GT and DH. I'd like them to be lighter, sure, but that would push their cost up even more, which already is a bit much...

 

[IceGamer]

The base car is around 3550 and doesn’t come with any meaningful carbon fiber. But this base car is well equipped.

The Camaro zl11le is 3837 lbs. That’s supercharged, additional cooling,upgraded suspension,etc.

A twin turbo car with 50-50 weight distribution can do better.

The mustang needs a new lighter, tighter platform.

You're not calling for a next gen Mustang but a $100k+ sportscar. A Mustang is a GT first and foremost. The Aston Martin is a great example. It can be modified to be a track tool but that's either on the customer or should be a special editions job. The average buyer isn't tracking their Mustang, hardly anyone does.
Besides, if a future Mustang is as pricey as a Corvette, why not buy a Corvette instead?! If it's what you want the Mustang to be buy the original. Average Joe knows that the Corvette is an upmarket product. A similar priced Mustang would have to be better in almost everything in order to justify the lacking image. Look at a C8 compared to a 911. The 911 has the better and more rounded image so if the C8 would be priced similar most people would buy a 911.

Anyhow, the Mustang needs a new platform. In order to keep the costs down one cannot come up with a Mustang dedicated platform but Ford has to have more use for it. And again it's irrelevant if you build SUVs, CUVs or GT cars on it. A modern platform can handle multiple different cars.

 

[MaddNomad]

You're not calling for a next gen Mustang but a $100k+ sportscar. A Mustang is a GT first and foremost. The Aston Martin is a great example. It can be modified to be a track tool but that's either on the customer or should be a special editions job. The average buyer isn't tracking their Mustang, hardly anyone does.
Besides, if a future Mustang is as pricey as a Corvette, why not buy a Corvette instead?! If it's what you want the Mustang to be buy the original. Average Joe knows that the Corvette is an upmarket product. A similar priced Mustang would have to be better in almost everything in order to justify the lacking image. Look at a C8 compared to a 911. The 911 has the better and more rounded image so if the C8 would be priced similar most people would buy a 911.

Anyhow, the Mustang needs a new platform. In order to keep the costs down one cannot come up with a Mustang dedicated platform but Ford has to have more use for it. And again it's irrelevant if you build SUVs, CUVs or GT cars on it. A modern platform can handle multiple different cars.

I mean not really, technically the Camaro used a brand new chassis and didn’t increase in price all too much while having what some consider better things like transmission. They took the alpha platform designed to take on bmw for Cadillac.

Ford would be doing it the other direction by taking their halo car and using the chassis for maybe 2 or 3 other vehicles. The argument people have is the Mustang price itself seems already bloated if you consider how long they used the chassis while having similar features from the previous model.

BTW it does matter if the chassis is used for other cars, specifically RWD/AWD coupe/sedans, not SUVs or CUVs.

There’s a reason why companies have 3 to 5 different variations of a “universal” platform. Like Toyota with TNGA ranges from sub-compacts, compacts, full size, body on frame etc. (they’re working on a specific rwd platform for sports cars too) if you used a one chassis fits all approach you would have a similar issue to the Charger Daytona (STLA Large platform) where you make a lot of compromises.

Considering Ford wants the Mustang to be a competitive sports car for everyone.

 

[MaddNomad]

I'm going into the weeds with this one...BUT...

Let's look at GT3 class racing cars. The Mustang GT3 just took 1st and 3rd at Daytona a few weeks back. That car has to fit both the power and weight limits of GT3...which according to Wikipedia is between 500 - 600hp and 2640 - 2860lbs.

The Mustang GT3 has 550hp and weighs 2836lbs, again, according to Wiki. I'm not sure if those numbers are adjusted with BOP, etc...but hey, it's all the info I have right now. The power isn't important, but the weight is. Of note, the Porsche GT3 R also needs to fit that criteria. That car would likely be at the lower end of the spectrum for both power and weight (I can't find the exact stats) with a very close power/weight ratio. Now the interesting thing is the delta between the street car and the race car.

The Porsche GT3 road car is around 3,150lbs with the race car being NO LIGHTER than 2,640lbs. That's a difference of 510lbs give or take depending on trim/transmission. When buying a GT3 (let's not even talk about the crazy RS) road car, you are TRULY getting a race car for the road.

The Mustang GTD road car, IF ACCURATE, at 4300+ pounds is a whopping 1,500lbs heavier than the race car. That delta is absolutely bonkers. The supercharged engine definitely contributes to that increase, but good LORD...where the hell does everything else come from? Did they accidently build the car out of Tungsten? Keep in mind, we're not talking about a GT or DH here...this is a $300k+ bespoke monster for the lucky few.

When speculations for this car were released way back when, I originally thought it would follow the Porsche approach: lightweight, LEAN AND MEAN, but with a naturally aspirated V8 of 5.2 or 5.4L of displacement (I was clearly dead wrong, lol). Given the same delta vs the Porsche example above, that would be like having a GTD that weighs roughly 3,400lbs with 600hp of NA delight.

Anyway, it's not like I have any stock in any of this...I just find it quite interesting.

EDIT: To be clear, I'm actually somewhat OK with where the weights are for the GT and DH. I'd like them to be lighter, sure, but that would push their cost up even more, which already is a bit much...

I still think the car is cool, something special about a Mustang getting a power up and competing with the big boys.

But sometimes I remember the Ford GT and even the 2004 Shelby Cobra concept they were gonna make before the economy got crazy. They were always positioned as that high level Vette and European fighters.

Maybe that’s why they always used those cars instead of throwing the Stang in the arena. When the 2nd gen Ford GT was developed they originally wanted to use the Mustang but scrapped it. I mean GTD is Farley’s brainchild.

 

[9secondko]

EDIT: To be clear, I'm actually somewhat OK with where the weights are for the GT and DH. I'd like them to be lighter, sure, but that would push their cost up even more, which already is a bit much...

To be fair, the Mustang currently is overpriced. It’s an old, heavy platform. Ford has been saving money left and right in these recycled cars. Making it lighter won’t automatically make it more expensive. It’s just a matter of ford caring. And clearly, well… you know.

It won’t get lighter until/if lightness is incorporated into the new platform from concept to execution.

 

[9secondko]

You're not calling for a next gen Mustang but a $100k+ sportscar. A Mustang is a GT first and foremost. The Aston Martin is a great example. It can be modified to be a track tool but that's either on the customer or should be a special editions job. The average buyer isn't tracking their Mustang, hardly anyone does.
Besides, if a future Mustang is as pricey as a Corvette, why not buy a Corvette instead?! If it's what you want the Mustang to be buy the original. Average Joe knows that the Corvette is an upmarket product. A similar priced Mustang would have to be better in almost everything in order to justify the lacking image. Look at a C8 compared to a 911. The 911 has the better and more rounded image so if the C8 would be priced similar most people would buy a 911.

Anyhow, the Mustang needs a new platform. In order to keep the costs down one cannot come up with a Mustang dedicated platform but Ford has to have more use for it. And again it's irrelevant if you build SUVs, CUVs or GT cars on it. A modern platform can handle multiple different cars.

Incorrect.

I’m calling for a next gen lightweight mustang.

Bang for the buck starts with being light.

Light does not equal expensive. That’s some pathetic math.

If the Chevrolet Camaro zl1 with all the goods could come in around 3800 on a shared platform, a dedicated mustang platform that is later shared among other models can do better. We’ve had nearly a decade of advancements.

Just because the automakers are taking in the inflated profit currently doesn’t mean that’s what they HAVE to do.

It’s a matter of simply being smart. A new platform is needed anyway. This one is decomposing before our eyes. Might as well go for it and do it right. Start off on the right foot. It will pay exponentially dividends down the line in every way including performance, fuel economy/range, wear and tear, etc. and that translates to value = “bang” for the buck.

The mustang has usually played with the exotics on a performance level though it cost barely a fraction of those cars. That’s the miracle of the high performance American v8 in a small, light car.

A new platform is the only way.

If GM could make an rven more niche car such as the c8 and sell it for what they sell it for, Ford can do even better with a car that will sell far more.

Enough of the simping for ford doing the minimal and selling for the maximum.

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