New Build! Ultimate Daily / Track Weapon Combo

[Junkyard Dog]

For horsepower ideas, Steeda managed to get 576 whp

https://www.mustang7g.com/forums/threads/576-horsepower-to-the-wheels-naturally-aspirated.173497/

without a blower or turbo, naturally aspirated, so it may be easier to keep cool on the track.

BUT

E85 may not be around every track. At Michelin Road Atlanta, E85 is available off track, a few miles away.

16 gallon tank

You will be filling it up often even if you use 93 octane. 5 sessions at Road Atlanta used two tanks of 93 gasoline. The Mustang is a heavy, thirsty car. Big engine and weight and track means lots of fuel. E85 will only make that worse.

Daily driver sort of rules out serious weight reduction. Wheels are about it.

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[Kennysum1]

OK, now that you and I are both fully aware that you know much more about this than I do, lol, here goes.

One set of 19" for daily driving with a good summer tire.

Tires and wheels for track only, go with 18" - much better selection of tires and some very serious track tires come only in that size and not in 19" (e.g., Michelin slicks)

Apex and others make barrels that will fit over large brakes in the 18" size. The Dark Horse R race cars use 18" wheels now, too (and one of the drivers has informed me over on trackmustangsonline.com that the 19" Michelins sucked and were more like a 200 tw street tire than a true racing slick).

My suggestion is 18 x 11 square set up with 295 or 305 30 aspect ratio, or 68 series slick. Serious, sticky tires.

Those are my suggestions, but what do I know? I was tracking on the stock Pirelli Trofeo RS tires that Ford puts on the Dark Horse. I have not tried tracking with another tire. The Trofeo RS were very grippy, but they are expensive and do not last long. I was seriously impressed though, especially with braking performance (the tires were perhaps why this car was Motor Trends' historical record holder for shortest braking distance, beating out the Porsche GT2RS).



I would seriously suggest trackmustangsonline.com for this question.

Since you want to daily drive it, I guess the question is whether you really, really want it optimized for the track. This very question was being discussed by @krisk in the S650 section over there, but keep in mind when reading the suggestions being made that he trailers his car to the track. It is definitely not a daily driver.

https://trackmustangsonline.com/threads/new-s650-suspension-setup-coilovers.21633/




LOL, I was going to say seats. In my Dark Horse, my lower back ached before the end of the day from trying to stiffen up and hold myself in place as I made direction changes at the limits of the tires.



After the wheels and some very sticky tires, Vorshlag (I would not even consider another brand) camber plates for the front (cut the shock tower) and rear upper camber arms so you can set 3.5° in the front and 2° in the rear, or more aggressive if you find that after sticky tires your suspension has slack so that you need it, then set the camber to a more sane setting for the 19" street tires that you are going to mount to drive to work and the grocery store and baseball practice for the kiddos (the reason I have a Dark Horse is my wife saw me looking at C7 Z06s and said, "You have kids, and you need a back seat." It has been a big running joke in our house that I have a car with a back seat now - can't fit the whole family, but my 9 year old loves riding in it to baseball practice and is wearing a Dark Horse T shirt an uncle gave him for Christmas even as I am typing this).

Then upgrade the brakes - I bet you already know some good brands of rotors and pads from prior cars that make set ups for the S650 Mustang - are you willing to swap pads for track and street, like wheels and tires and camber?

P.S. Vorshlag had a 2024 Dark Horse development car, so they are going to know what fits and works on the S650. They also had an S550.

After the suspension is chosen (sorry I cannot be of any help there), then look at increasing the horsepower of the Coyote and definitely upgrade cooling. The Mishimoto radiator is the same thickness as the Dark Horse radiator. I do not know whether it is identical in other respects, but it seems like a good choice to get more cooling. Look at the Dark Horse R manuals out there online for other cooling mods, such as drilling out the fan shrouds (they show locations and all, but I have been hesitant about this on a daily driver that might get stuck in traffic for an hour in Atlanta traffic in August). If you are really going to run for hours you are going to want a differential oil cooler (a few companies make them, or you can buy the Ford version) and a separate engine oil cooler. Is this a manual or the auto 10 speed? Anyway, transmission cooler . . .

My man over here cooking with gas now! Agree 100% on the tires. Going 18x11 for track. I did end up deciding to bite the bullet and have a separate set of track rims instead of the balancing act on the 19s.

Yea those freakin Trofeo RS are some MONSTER tires... people might sleep on them some because they are "stock".

If you check out the Q500 from Steeda you will have a pretty good build list of the car I am working on. I am going to go slightly more aggressive on the suspension but will go with a 305 and not a wider 315. Most likely. Still toying with it a bit.

 

[BimmerDriver]

I also got smoked by a 75 year old dude in slick hustle one time.

You gotta watch out for those devious seniors, LOL.

The better the car is setup though the more planted it will feel.... right up until its not lol. Not going to get a lot of warning from the car until it breaks loose on the super aggressive setups.

I had forgotten about this, good point. A friend of mine asked me how I know the limits of the car, and I answered that you don't know the limit until you exceed it. If the car is set up well (as I believe the DH w/o HP is) it communicates pretty well.

I drove the HP on the street but not the track, so I'm not sure how it behaves there.

Anyway, it sounds like you've got your head on straight and have the financial resources to do it right, so I'm not too worried about you. Just watch out for those wiley old guys...

 

[MidwayJ]

I think I confused the shit out of people lol.

I think it had a lot to do with this from your OP:

I am not the Mustang expert you all are on a track.

It was interpreted as a more general reference, including driving on a track. All good, though! The back and forth has been entertaining.

 

[Kennysum1]

I think it had a lot to do with this from your OP:


It was interpreted as a more general reference, including driving on a track. All good, though! The back and forth has been entertaining.

haha yea it for sure kicked the thread off! I stay so damn busy I need to be more clear sometimes.

I meant it in a literal sense of the Mustang platform on a road course. In reality I should have just applied what I know from other cars and asked for advice on particular parts. Kind of stupid of me as the S650 platform is fairly new for the modding world. Luckily its a Mustang though.

I can help you all day long if you wanna go fast in a straight line! Parts and all!

 

[krisk]

The vast majority of the modifications I have made for track use on my GT PP are suspension related. Camber plates, springs, sway bars / end links, rear toe links, rear camber arms, subframe braces, etc are the most useful upgrades in my opinion. Some are not essential, but aftermarket parts make dialing in the alignment settings much easier. After drilling the shock towers I can get the front to around -4.0, although I’m only running around -3.5 on track. All my suspension components are Steeda. I initially installed another brand rear toe links and camber arms and they gave me trouble, so I switched to Steeda.

I did have to add a differential cooler since the axle was overheating. I have the 6 piston front 4 piston rear Brembos, so all I did for brakes was add Gloc track pads and SRF brake fluid.

Wheels I’m running 19x11 square with 295/30. I don’t think the 18s will work with the PP/DH front Brembos, but I think they will for the non PP/DH setup.

I’ve thought about adding a front splitter and adjustable rear wing, but I’m afraid it would be too much for just aftermarket springs without going to a coilover setup. I’m not ready to drop $6k more on decent coilovers at this time.

For the interior, Watson Racing has both 4 and 6 point bolt in roll bars as well as brackets for mounting lap belts for, both of which eliminate the need for extensive drilling and welding. Plenty of options for seats, mounts harnesses, etc which will work in the car. Of course, the cage, fixed seat, and harness may not be the desired route if still planning to daily the car.

The Mustang isn’t a race car, but it runs pretty well on track for me. That said, I’m no professional racer; just an old guy running HPDE.

 

[Junkyard Dog]

Wheels I’m running 19x11 square with 295/30. I don’t think the 18s will work with the PP/DH front Brembos, but I think they will for the non PP/DH setup.

From Vorshlag, some wheel. LOL, a pun! Some will.

 

[krisk]

From Vorshlag, some wheel. LOL, a pun! Some will.

Good to hear it’s possible. I just know my 19’s don’t have much clearance with the wheel weights, so I imagine the weight placement would be very important with 18’s.

 

[Junkyard Dog]

Good to hear it’s possible. I just know my 19’s don’t have much clearance with the wheel weights, so I imagine the weight placement would be very important with 18’s.

I have also read about tire rubber from the track or other debris getting caught between the caliper and the wheel and damaging the inside of the wheel when there is so little clearance.

 

[krisk]

I have also read about tire rubber from the track or other debris getting caught between the caliper and the wheel and damaging the inside of the wheel when there is so little clearance.

Funny you mention that. I almost said in my previous post that I already have the barrels of my wheels marked up from marbles getting stuck on the calipers. I imagine it would be worse with 18’s. It doesn’t matter to me since they are track use, but if it was a daily then it might bother me.

 

[Junkyard Dog]

But they open a whole world of tires like the Michelin Pilot Sport GT M, which shaves on average 2.5 seconds off the lap time of the Hoosier R7, 101.1 seconds v. 98.63, and stayed consistent longer, later braking, higher speed in the turn, and more throttle application.



And that was with a street driving camber set up (which they said is "nowhere near" two degrees, the minimum recommended by Michelin).

 

[krisk]

But they open a whole world of tires like the Michelin Pilot Sport GT M, which shaves on average 2.5 seconds off the lap time of the Hoosier R7, 101.1 seconds v. 98.63, and stayed consistent longer, later braking, higher speed in the turn, and more throttle application.

If I ever decide I want any to start racing, then that may be a concern. Right now I’m happy with running 200TW endurance tires. Getting into racing would be a whole different mindset with my existing build.

 

[Junkyard Dog]

https://www.tirerack.com/tires/tire...all=Blackwall&partnum=306818PSGTSV2&tab=Sizes

10.7" tread width

26.7" tall, so it will play well with the car's electronics

This is the S8M, but they also come in 7 and 9.

 

[RLE55]

If I ever decide I want any to start racing, then that may be a concern. Right now I’m happy with running 200TW endurance tires. Getting into racing would be a whole different mindset with my existing build.

Yes it is. As I was ready to move out of HPDE (with NASA), I was convinced that racing class American Iron was my next move. After talking to many drivers and weighing the cost factor as well as potential damage factor, I reconsidered the racing classes. Instead, went into Time Trials (TT3) and loved it. Cost factor for TT was not as bad as it would have been in racing class, but converting a street car into dedicated TT car, took time and $$. In TT, as you are always looking to go faster and improve your times, there's always improvements to consider, from aero to tires to suspension and so on. I spent 5 years in HPDE (2 in HPDE4) and wanted more and was totally committed to making the changes needed to be successful in TT. A great experience and I miss it.
The evolution from street/show car to HPDE to TT.

 

[MustangNoob]

Yes, for any SC application, you need to keep the power planted & some people feel a big improvement with the https://www.steeda.com/Steeda-S550-...7nb8PQqRIfXB_z-mDW40O5Gy0f80z_1xxW-wfhGoGaKTp

But with higher HP applications & more spiritied activities - the Ultimate Kit is https://www.steeda.com/steeda-mustang-ultimate-irs-stop-the-hop-package-2015-all-555-2129.html the preferred

Here to help if you want me to put you in contact with our suspension team that speacilizes in the SC department & planting that power!

is the upgrade from street starter kit to ultimate handling relatively easy to do if the first is already installed?

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