Gen 4 coyote odd things to note

[Gogoggansgo]

Confirmation on 7250rpm cutoff?

Yes Carlos Lagos confirmed it

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[Gogoggansgo]

i can't find anything anywhere about premium being required
here's from eSourceBook, Ford's information system for dealers (V8 is both GT and DH)

Engine Type	2.3L EcoBoost​	5.0L Ti-VCT V8​
Fuel Requirement (octane)	87 (min.)/91+ (rec.)​	87 (min.)/91+ (rec.)​

We won’t know definitively till you get your owners manual, but two of the reviews said the engineers told premium what we required wink wink. My guess it will be a lot like the GT350, it’ll run but it won’t like it on regular where the run of the mill coyote for the most part doesn’t care

 

[zstanny]

Yes Carlos Lagos confirmed it

This makes no sense. The 5.0 making the same tq in the DH as the GT, but having higher HP, suggests that the additional power is at the top end. A lot of us were actually anticipating a higher rev limit to accomplish this.

Not saying you or whoever carlos lagos is wrong. Just pointing out my issue with it.

 

[Gogoggansgo]

This makes no sense. The 5.0 making the same tq in the DH as the GT, but having higher HP, suggests that power is at the top end. A lot of us were actually anticipating a higher rev limit to accomplish this.

Not saying you or whoever carlos lagos is wrong. Just pointing out my issue with it.

I agree I’m the one that made the simulated engines last month you can find my posts. Also, this wouldn’t be the first time in OEM has done this btw Porsche did this with the 911 R that was the one that had the brand new manual transmission, they didn’t trust the flywheel or clutch to handle 9000 RPM. so they put the redline at 8700 below peak power and made a whole lotta people mad

So it sounds like we have a similar situation here, the problem is the driveline can handle it. It could be a warranty issue, or they’re intentionally holding it back or something.

 

[zstanny]

I agree I’m the one that made the simulated engines last month you can find my posts.

Yeah I remember. For the DH, I was expecting a similar plot, similar slope as below...but with the max rpms bumped out so that a higher HP was achieved. Call me confused until we see some dyno runs.

 

[Gogoggansgo]

Yeah I remember. For the DH, I was expecting a similar plot, similar slope as below...but with the max rpms bumped out so that a higher HP was achieved. Call me confused until we see some dynos runs.

That’s what i can’t figure out is the Dark horse a mustang gt with another 14-20hp across the whole rpm range, like the mach 1s dyno at or is this like the boss 302 where its all top end and down low, the tq curve is just flatter. The dark horse is starting to sound like a wet noddle of if it has a 7250rpm soft limiter and that peak power. No thanks

 

[Gogoggansgo]

FYI we don’t know official peak numbers for the dark horse, it could be the same as the GT at 7150-7250rpm, it could be lower at 7000rpm or way out at 7500rpm. Ford hasn’t realized the dirty details which is very suspicious

This is a simulated dark horse vs mustang gt with active exhaust, the gt is spot on perfect with the sim

 

[NightSurgeX2]

and the extra 14HP are not gonna overcome the 2-300lbs weight difference.

Where did you see that the DH has a 200-300lb weight increase over the PP GT?

 

[Gogoggansgo]

Where did you see that the DH has a 200-300lb weight increase over the PP GT?

It’s 3900 pounds without a full tank or driver i don’t think it’s 300 pounds more but that’s a 4200 pound car. I doubt it’ll be any faster than a mach 1 in a straight line

I really like the dark horse but damn it needs to be a tad cheaper “msrp is dumb” and it needed another 15-20hp IMO

 

[NightSurgeX2]

It’s 3900 pounds without a full tank or driver i don’t think it’s 300 pounds more but that’s a 4200 pound car. I doubt it’ll be any faster than a mach 1 in a straight line

I really like the dark horse but damn it needs to be a tad cheaper “msrp is dumb” and it needed another 15-20hp IMO

He said that the DH is 200-300 lbs heavier than the GT with PP (at least that's the way I interpreted it).

Online, the best I can find is that the GT weight range is 3600-3900lbs (assuming PP gets it to the 3900 mark?). The best I can find online for the DH weight is 3900lbs, so not 200-300 lbs heavier. I'm sure the added coolers and aero adds some weight, but definitely not 200-300 lbs.

I do agree, though, that I think the DH should be pushing higher TQ and HP to help differentiate it from the GT PP cars and justify the price some more. I'm hoping that I can just throw a "Ford approved" power adder onto my DH in a few years and it will handle the added power without much else needed.

 

[Q6543]

Nope… I’m talking base GT, without the extra, aero, coolers, fancy interior bits, stereo, braces, sway bars, etc.

 

[Gogoggansgo]

Nope… I’m talking base GT, without the extra, aero, coolers, fancy interior bits, stereo, braces, sway bars, etc.

I’m sorry it’s not maybe 200 pounds at maximum but that’s worse case scenario, most of these cars will end up in the 38-4000 pounds range

 

[Gogoggansgo]

He said that the DH is 200-300 lbs heavier than the GT with PP (at least that's the way I interpreted it).

Online, the best I can find is that the GT weight range is 3600-3900lbs (assuming PP gets it to the 3900 mark?). The best I can find online for the DH weight is 3900lbs, so not 200-300 lbs heavier. I'm sure the added coolers and aero adds some weight, but definitely not 200-300 lbs.

I do agree, though, that I think the DH should be pushing higher TQ and HP to help differentiate it from the GT PP cars and justify the price some more. I'm hoping that I can just throw a "Ford approved" power adder onto my DH in a few years and it will handle the added power without much else needed.

The dark horse is what the mach 1 should of been and the dark horse really should of gotten an gen 4 with 5.2 displacement, the only difference is the stroke, and the piston speed at 7500 vs the current 5.0 stroke is minimal. Point being a gen 4 based 5.2 with 530hp would of been cool af

 

[Katastrophe]

A quick question about the soft limiter...I haven't heard anything about that on the GT models with the numerous reviews that were published. Does that mean only the DH has one?

100% I'm so lost on this. I don't even know why this is a thing on a supposedly high performance machine. Hopefully when people start taking delivery of their cars, we can get some clarity on the behavior of the engines.

 

[Gogoggansgo]

A quick question about the soft limiter...I haven't heard anything about that on the GT models with the numerous reviews that were published. Does that mean only the DH has one?

100% I'm so lost on this. I don't even know why this is a thing on a supposedly high performance machine. Hopefully when people start taking delivery of their cars, we can get some clarity on the behavior of the engines.

The Mustang gt doesn’t have it, it’s gotta be related to peak power and something in the drive line they don’t trust. If it was 100 rpm like 7400 who cares but 250rpm it’s a lot especially when you’re tracking the car

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