Did Mustangs in Europe came to end?

[CPT_RSV]

I typed an edit in my post with a longer answer. I'll paste it here:
Edit: if you want a longer answer, the US has always had a 25% tax on light trucks imported from other places and Europe was a largesupplier of that for many decades, which is why the initial 10% tariff was always there. Trump in his first term put a massive tariff that the EU responded with, as did the rest of the world. And now Trump thinks he can do the same playbook and get results again, but the world has woken up to this and learned.

This also isn't taking into account that the demand for american cars across the world is not as high as it is in their own country. This is a key part about why Trump's understanding of this trade war doesn't make sense. The trade deficit exists because Europeans are simply not as interested in American cars compared to their own or other countries'. It doesn't help nor hurt Ford because no one wants to drive a gigantic F150 down the streets of paris or rome when their own cities are not built for these large vehicles. EDIT here: (side note, apologies for a lot of edits on posts, I just have a lot of thoughts that tend to come after I've already posted). If you talk to people in Europe, the reason why the demand for cars from America specifically is not high is because of the cost and the size. American cars cost too much because of labor costs as well as supply costs (hint, this is why American companies themselves offshore a ton of the vehicle production). Bringing those cars into Europe essentially prices them against European companies who already produce cars that are fit for their cities and roads and also have more demand in general to support themselves locally. This is essentially the same as how it works in America too. The EU has floated a zero for zero tariff, which is essentially free trade. And I don't think Americans, especially republicans as of late would like the results if there was a world where there was free market capitalism. Especially in a world where the EU has also been working with China to get their EVs into market. This is a key point to understand. Doug Demuro who is a massive car enthusiast touched upon this with EVs here:

Also I love the argument that tariffs are helping American workers and bringing back american jobs, because I'd love for you to point out how many companies actually end up bringing manufacturing jobs back to the US. Announcements /= actual action. Look up foxconn in trump's first term, apple has been promising this for years. Auto makers have also promised this for years and not delivered. The hard truth is the US is not the manufacturing giant it once was and pivoted its economy to more service based goods, but the people of yesteryear cannot accept that as a reality and want to return to a manufacturing economy. Young people, especially gen z and millenials, do not want to work in a manufacturing economy. ESPECIALLY one where tech seems to be pushing hard for automation, hence making those manufacturing jobs useless.

EDIT: and ironically enough, european car companies have some of their biggest manufacturing plants in America, which is supplying American jobs. BMW's biggest plant is in America

There are tons of European cars in America. I’ve owned a very large handful of them. Like you said there are virtually no American cars seen in Europe. That creates a trade deficit and the reasons matter very little when viewing the bottom line. A great example was in the 80’s when the Reagan administration placed harsh tariffs on Japanese motorcycles. If they didn’t, there would be no Harley Davidson. Free trade, in a perfect world, can work only if there are no other obstacles to American corporations doing business in those countries we trade with. Perfect example, East Asia. They have been purposefully saturating the world markets with everything from steel to rubber dog poo at a deep discount due to the benefits of slave labor. As a result, tens of thousands of businesses were forced to shutter around the world, as they could no longer compete in their own domestic markets. In addition, this resulted in East Asia riding a trillion-dollar-per-year trade surplus, and that’s considering only the US. This was not incidental, rather done with purpose to seize control of the world supply chains in order to gain power, which they did. And if any country placed tariffs on them to compensate for the massive trade losses, they would simply send their products to the same country through other countries (even countries that house only penguins), then re-stamp those products so they showed as being manufactured in the chosen country rather than its actual point of origin….hence the reason the Trump administration placed blanket tariffs on every country in the world. East Asia works with a 5% profit margin. The blanket tariffs placed on all other countries was 10%, double what East Asia requires to survive. This war is not with our allies. Over the coming months, it will become painfully apparent (if it hasn’t already) who the geopolitical target is. My uneducated guess is the US will have fair or fairer trade deals with every country in the world, sans one. And that “one” has been more destructive to world trade than any other entity in history. Interestingly, the US makes up less than 5% of the world population, yet its consumers are responsible for 30% of goods purchased. Do the math and you’ll find that East Asia, who’s economy can exist only by exports, isn’t going to last very long after decoupling. Sadly, I also believe none of this is going to end well for anybody. Harsh tariffs look a lot like sanctions and embargo’s. World wars break out over ____ like that. Even so, if that be the case, it’s a worthy endeavor. If things were allowed to carry on as they were, America and its dollar would be worth nothing within twenty years.

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[kagemusha2662]

There are tons of European cars in America. I’ve owned a very large handful of them. Like you said there are virtually no American cars seen in Europe. That creates a trade deficit and the reasons matter very little when viewing the bottom line. A great example was in the 80’s when the Reagan administration placed harsh tariffs on Japanese motorcycles. If they didn’t, there would be no Harley Davidson. Free trade, in a perfect world, can work only if there are no other obstacles to American corporations doing business in those countries we trade with. Perfect example, East Asia. They have been purposefully saturating the world markets with everything from steel to rubber dog poo at a deep discount due to the benefits of slave labor. As a result, tens of thousands of businesses were forced to shutter around the world, as they could no longer compete in their own domestic markets. In addition, this resulted in East Asia riding a trillion-dollar-per-year trade surplus, and that’s considering only the US. This was not incidental, rather done with purpose to seize control of the world supply chains in order to gain power, which they did. And if any country placed tariffs on them to compensate for the massive trade losses, they would simply send their products to the same country through other countries (even countries that house only penguins), then re-stamp those products so they showed as being manufactured in the chosen country rather than its actual point of origin….hence the reason the Trump administration placed blanket tariffs on every country in the world. East Asia works with a 5% profit margin. The blanket tariffs placed on all other countries was 10%, double what East Asia requires to survive. This war is not with our allies. Over the coming months, it will become painfully apparent (if it hasn’t already) who the geopolitical target is. My uneducated guess is the US will have fair or fairer trade deals with every country in the world, sans one. And that “one” has been more destructive to world trade than any other entity in history. Interestingly, the US makes up less than 5% of the world population, yet its consumers are responsible for 30% of goods purchased. Do the math and you’ll find that East Asia, who’s economy can exist only by exports, isn’t going to last very long after decoupling. Sadly, I also believe none of this is going to end well for anybody. Harsh tariffs look a lot like sanctions and embargo’s. World wars break out over ____ like that. Even so, if that be the case, it’s a worthy endeavor. If things were allowed to carry on as they were, America and its dollar would be worth nothing within twenty years.

I agree with most of this, this entire thing is all about China. I find it disingenuous when people claim the entire world is ripping off the US. Which is also why I think the blanket tariff policy that he did was an awful idea.There was a concerted effort to nip this in the bud like an agreement in place to do exactly this around the time of Obama's end and near Trump's first term, TTIP for the EU and the Trans Pacific Partnership. Both were essentially free trade for the US at a time when the dollar was insanely strong and the US was arguably at peak power. Both failed, and are a big reason why the world is how it is now and why so many countries have a massive dependence on China. And now it's even harder given the blanket tariffs, which essentially is forcing countries to either place their own economy at risk by entering bad trade agreements or work with China, which is bad for the US.

Where i start to disagree with is a trade deficit is not a bad thing. That's the problem is it's viewed negatively because people only view physical manufactured goods as valuable. People have said this many times over the past weeks, but think about going to a restaurant and you buy stuff from them. You are now running a trade surplus with the restaurant, it would be odd for the restaurant owner to turn to you and say now it's your turn to buy something from me. And even then, they probably are buying something from you if for example, you're working a white collar job at a bank or a tech company that provides services for that restaurant. Trade deficits are inherently not a bad thing and are almost all situational.

Another thing that I disagree with is the implication that the US consumer will continue to purchase 30% of the world's goods. If the US enters a depression or goes back to a manufacturing economy, peoples' spending power/wages will inherently go back down to a level where spending is not incentivized. I touched on this in another comment, but the timing of wanting more manufacturing could not come at a worse time because of the AI boom/investment that president Trump himself is pushing.

 

[LouG]

I said in another post that I couldn't have a Mustang in Italy unless I had a small town car as well. It's just too big.
Yes, I know people drive large SUV's there, but most I saw were diesel, a V8 petrol engine at 3 or more euros a litre gets expensive.
And I remember in the 50's and 60's in NZ there were some US cars, but they were nearly all owned by farmers who had the necessary overseas funds to buy them, and they had a fuel tax dodge that made them less expensive to run.
Now it's mainly silly Boomers like me who buy them.
I love being a boomer.

 

[Bear376]

No matter how you look at it, double the price for a Mustang is not beneficial to anyone but the bureaucrats. Part of the issues is the cost to modify any car to meet the standards of another market.
And every nation has issues with the problems of a global economy. China is the bully of the world due to its stranglehold on many consumer items, but they are starting to feel the effects of countries pushing back and corporations taking their business elsewhere. One expert is saying that there are strong signs of a regime change in China.

The States and other elected governments have an issue with politicians. Instead of attacking the issues that concern the public, they put forth legislation that appeases their vocal minorities, knowing that it will fail. Then they will pass minor bills that have no real meaning. It's all a political shell game. And it does not matter who gets elected, the likelihood is that even 20-40 years from now, it will all still be debated. Heck, we still debate every aspect about the War between the States. I hope that things work out to where anyone that wants to afford a Mustang in any nation is given the opportunity, but the average person in Europe is not going to find driving one around many towns to be practical.

 

[Ace]

I believe the reason they stoped the import is the upcoming Euro 7 in November 2025. That being said, if you order now, there is high probability car would arrive by November and that is the time Euro 7 comes in place. One more interesting thing. If you look at german configurator now, they dropped the price by @ 10% to approximately 60k € from original 66-67k. Seems like they are trying to sell out remaining stock.

This doesn't add up, Euro 7 will come in affect in November 2026, not 2025, but only for new homologated cars. The S650 is already homologated, so they can sell it as it is until November 2027. On top they removed the increased pollution requirements, so for CO² nothing changes at all. The base changes are more rewards longelivety of parts and tire compounds.

So since everybody went into useless political discussions, does anybody has similiar informations about discontinuation of the S650 in Europe? I will reach out to the dealers in Germany I know

 

[CPT_RSV]

There are tons of European cars in America. I’ve owned a very large handful of them. Like you said there are virtually no American cars seen in Europe. That creates a trade deficit and the reasons matter very little when viewing the bottom line. A great example was in the 80’s when the Reagan administration placed harsh tariffs on Japanese motorcycles. If they didn’t, there would be no Harley Davidson. Free trade, in a perfect world, can work only if there are no other obstacles to American corporations doing business in those countries we trade with. Perfect example, East Asia. They have been purposefully saturating the world markets with everything from steel to rubber dog poo at a deep discount due to the benefits of slave labor. As a result, tens of thousands of businesses were forced to shutter around the world, as they could no longer compete in their own domestic markets. In addition, this resulted in East Asia riding a trillion-dollar-per-year trade surplus, and that’s considering only the US. This was not incidental, rather done with purpose to seize control of the world supply chains in order to gain power, which they did. And if any country placed tariffs on them to compensate for the massive trade losses, they would simply send their products to the same country through other countries (even countries that house only penguins), then re-stamp those products so they showed as being manufactured in the chosen country rather than its actual point of origin….hence the reason the Trump administration placed blanket tariffs on every country in the world. East Asia works with a 5% profit margin. The blanket tariffs placed on all other countries was 10%, double what East Asia requires to survive. This war is not with our allies. Over the coming months, it will become painfully apparent (if it hasn’t already) who the geopolitical target is. My uneducated guess is the US will have fair or fairer trade deals with every country in the world, sans one. And that “one” has been more destructive to world trade than any other entity in history. Interestingly, the US makes up less than 5% of the world population, yet its consumers are responsible for 30% of goods purchased. Do the math and you’ll find that East Asia, who’s economy can exist only by exports, isn’t going to last very long after decoupling. Sadly, I also believe none of this is going to end well for anybody. Harsh tariffs look a lot like sanctions and embargo’s. World wars break out over ____ like that. Even so, if that be the case, it’s a worthy endeavor. If things were allowed to carry on as they were, America and its dollar would be worth nothing within twenty years.

No matter how you look at it, double the price for a Mustang is not beneficial to anyone but the bureaucrats. Part of the issues is the cost to modify any car to meet the standards of another market.
And every nation has issues with the problems of a global economy. China is the bully of the world due to its stranglehold on many consumer items, but they are starting to feel the effects of countries pushing back and corporations taking their business elsewhere. One expert is saying that there are strong signs of a regime change in China.

The States and other elected governments have an issue with politicians. Instead of attacking the issues that concern the public, they put forth legislation that appeases their vocal minorities, knowing that it will fail. Then they will pass minor bills that have no real meaning. It's all a political shell game. And it does not matter who gets elected, the likelihood is that even 20-40 years from now, it will all still be debated. Heck, we still debate every aspect about the War between the States. I hope that things work out to where anyone that wants to afford a Mustang in any nation is given the opportunity, but the average person in Europe is not going to find driving one around many towns to be practical.

I was pissed about what I paid for my 2024 base model GT bought in late 2023. It was the only one I could find that had a six-speed manual. $54,000! Then, of course I was compelled to get rims and tires and coilovers and all of the other crap is still yet to come. Yeah sure, some of the prices seemed motivated by greed, some I’m sure are the results of stiffer regulatory requirements, but mostly it seems that ever since the previous administration began pushing EV mandates (that few of us wanted), the car industry has suffered tremendously.

 

[Nightmonkey]

@Cipis Any new informations from other dealers?
A temporary hold on orders for Mustangs is nothing new.

There are tons of European cars in America. I’ve owned a very large handful of them. Like you said there are virtually no American cars seen in Europe

Your problem is that you don't recognize such vehicles.
The best example is BMW X5, you see them here in Germany on every corner, you see them in the US on every corner and it is made in Spartanburg (sounds kind of german, but is in the US).

Ford was also a big player here in the EU until the US parent company (like GM with Opel) thought it knew the market outside the US better than the local people.
If things go badly, Ford will disappear from Europe altogether because popular models such as the Fiesta, Focus and Mondeo have been discontinued. Noone here will buy the US Fiesta aka F-150.

 

[Cipis]

This doesn't add up, Euro 7 will come in affect in November 2026, not 2025, but only for new homologated cars. The S650 is already homologated, so they can sell it as it is until November 2027. On top they removed the increased pollution requirements, so for CO² nothing changes at all. The base changes are more rewards longelivety of parts and tire compounds.

So since everybody went into useless political discussions, does anybody has similiar informations about discontinuation of the S650 in Europe? I will reach out to the dealers in Germany I know

ok, my bad if I messed up the date of Euro. I have been talking to another two dealers today, no one knows why but Mustangs are on hold, and no further info why or till when. I am glad I manage to get at least new one yet from left overs. I agree here in Europe you don’t see many US cars. Recently more than 30 years ago, but compared to US and EU cars in there, that is no comparable. It does not make much sense why this stop happened, however life is short and I do not want to waste any time on things I cannot change. There are some very good writings above I understand the point. Makes me feel a little fear what is going to happen in future as history kind of repeats. Therefore my advice for my fellows from Europe is - If Mustang or any other car you dreamed of is there, get it now. Tomorrow’s might be much darker…

 

[Cipis]

@Cipis Any new informations from other dealers?
A temporary hold on orders for Mustangs is nothing new.

No orders. No info why. Whether temp or permanent, nobody knows. Well if you say temp orders hold are nothing new, then it’s maybe just as you said and hopefully nothing to worry about.

 

[GrabThatBlue]

They’re likely on hold because European dealers are hesitant to place new Mustang orders, especially with the risk of higher costs due to a potential tariff change. The EU has drafted a list of U.S. products that could face increased import duties if ongoing trade tensions with the U.S. aren't resolved. Until there’s clarity, dealers may be avoiding commitments that could unexpectedly impact pricing.

So it's not likely that it's the end of the Mustang, but they are on hold because the EU and US are still negotiating.

 

[Wiley Marmot]

US: You're a punk!

Them: No! You're a punk!

US: I said it first!

Them: I said it louder!

Both: MOM!!!!

 

[Cipis]

They’re likely on hold because European dealers are hesitant to place new Mustang orders, especially with the risk of higher costs due to a potential tariff change. The EU has drafted a list of U.S. products that could face increased import duties if ongoing trade tensions with the U.S. aren't resolved. Until there’s clarity, dealers may be avoiding commitments that could unexpectedly impact pricing.

So it's not likely that it's the end of the Mustang, but they are on hold because the EU and US are still negotiating.

That is highly possible as well. Since you mentioned. We in Europe did not get price increase yet. Meaning if you would order Molten Magenta last week or weeks before (New paints were available here only this year), it would come still for the same price as last summer S650 price was. Now the germany on ford.de gives this huge Mustangs discounts on their website, yet you cannot order. I don’t get it.

 

[Cipis]

They’re likely on hold because European dealers are hesitant to place new Mustang orders, especially with the risk of higher costs due to a potential tariff change. The EU has drafted a list of U.S. products that could face increased import duties if ongoing trade tensions with the U.S. aren't resolved. Until there’s clarity, dealers may be avoiding commitments that could unexpectedly impact pricing.

So it's not likely that it's the end of the Mustang, but they are on hold because the EU and US are still negotiating.

I wish you are right.

 

[GrabThatBlue]

I wish you are right.

"The EU then announced its own 90-day pause on countermeasures against the United States. “We want to give negotiations a chance,” European Commission President Ursula von der Leyen said at the time."

The EU is ‘making progress’ toward a €50 billion trade deal with the US, trade commissioner tells FT | CNN Business

We are as we speak in the middle of this 90 day pause, so all large or small importers aren't going to take any risks until it's solved.

 

[IFFV68]

Hi Wiley,
Thank you for your emphasis.

I didn’t take the chance of not getting anything, so I got the configuration I wanted apart from color. The Molten Magenta was a dream and I was waiting for this color to be released to order here in EU, which was this January/Feb. I was waiting too long. The dealer checked all around germany and there was not single one with Magne and AT trans. (EU has all 401A spec as base). So I booked this spec. in yellow, which is now standing in german Cologne (Köln). It will be transported to my dealer in 12 weeks from today. My wife wanted the yellow from beginning, so it is disappointing to me only. Thinking backwards, I am happy I am able to get any new Mustang at all.

The yellow splash, Rapid Red & Atlas blue have all been discontinued in the United States for 2026.
I live in the Denver, Colorado area and some of the dealers here don’t even have any mustangs.
The Ford deal her believe June through September are the Mustang months. I think it’s crazy. I bought my Rapid Red GT, 401-A , 10-Speed in March.
Good luck,
The tariffs can’t last forever.
Good Luck
My best friend spent two years in the Army in Stuttgart?

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