Why's Ford not allowing people to tune the S650 Mustang?

[schmeky7]

Watched a YT video from a guy with DRP Motorsports and he made some compelling comments about the S650.

1) Warranties. According to insider info Ford locked the ECU since folks had tuned trucks (and to a lesser extent Mustangs) and Ford suspected ECU mods, but could not prove it.
2) Emissions. EPA is cracking down as well.

Makes sense if you want to to go all out with virtually unlimited mods and affordable boost (ESS), then a used 550 makes a lot of sense.

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[ZXMustang]

Watched a YT video from a guy with DRP Motorsports and he made some compelling comments about the S650.

1) Warranties. According to insider info Ford locked the ECU since folks had tuned trucks (and to a lesser extent Mustangs) and Ford suspected ECU mods, but could not prove it.
2) Emissions. EPA is cracking down as well.

Makes sense if you want to to go all out with virtually unlimited mods and affordable boost (ESS), then a used 550 makes a lot of sense.

As I said earlier in this thread, the reason is the connected nature of these cars. Your personal data, vehicle data as well as driving dynamics data is all stored and available to Ford through secure encrypted communication. if they allow any module to be accessed and written to, they are opening them up to any type of man-in-the-middle attack on your data. And Data breaches these days are about the worst security breach you can manage. The aftermath for a company could cause catastrophic monetary damage.

This isnt about warranty or emissions. Its about your data being protected and Ford's ability to do so. Thats it. Sorry wish it was more interesting, but its not.

 

[schmeky7]

I did not say it was either. Just posting insights from a YT'er.

 

[ShadowCoyote]

This is how my AI would approach this problem to get the ability to tune these cars.


To be clear: bypassing OEM encryption protections on ECUs (like the 2024+ Mustang GT’s PCM/TCM) would violate U.S. federal laws, particularly the DMCA (17 U.S. Code § 1201), unless done for approved security research or with the manufacturer’s authorization. That said, for theoretical and academic analysis, here's how one would typically assess such a secure architecture:


Modern ECU Security Architecture Summary (2024+ Mustang GT):

1. Secure Boot + Code Signing – Bootloaders validate firmware signatures.
2. Encrypted Flash Regions – Firmware and calibration regions are encrypted.
3. JTAG/SWD Lockout – Debugging interfaces disabled or require authentication.
4. Read/Write Partition Control – Cal area protected by region-based access.
5. Asymmetric Key Exchange – Signing done using Ford-held private key; ECU only holds public key.

Theoretical Attack Vectors:
1. Side-Channel Attacks

• Objective: Extract cryptographic keys via power analysis or EM radiation.
• Tools: ChipWhisperer, oscilloscope, differential power analysis (DPA).
• Reality: Requires destructive testing on desoldered MCU. Effective only on poorly protected key storage.

2. Flash Dump via Chip-Off

• Objective: Desolder MCU, dump flash and EEPROM directly.
• Tools: Hot air station, BGA rework, programmer (Xeltek, TL866), NAND readers.
• Reality: Almost always encrypted. Without matching keys, data is useless.

3. Glitching or Fault Injection

• Objective: Temporarily bypass security checks using voltage or clock glitches.
• Tools: EMFI (electromagnetic fault injection), crowbar setups, voltage glitchers.
• Reality: Used in Tesla, Xbox, and iPhone exploits. Only feasible with full lab setup and dozens of test units.

4. Vehicle Bus Exploits (e.g. UDS, CAN, FlexRay)

• Objective: Abuse diagnostic routines (e.g. 0x27 SecurityAccess) for flash mode entry.
• Tools: CAN interface (Kvaser, Intrepid, or MPVI3 with custom commands).
• Reality: Modern ECUs use rolling seed-key challenge with unique VIN-tied or HMAC-salted derivation. Brute force is infeasible.

5. Reverse Engineering Ford's Diagnostic Tools

• Objective: Analyze IDS/FDRS or dealership-level flash tools for private unlock logic.
• Tools: Static disassembly (IDA Pro, Ghidra), network intercept (Fiddler, Wireshark).
• Reality: Fails at encryption layer. Any flash routine still relies on signed binaries.

6. Leaked Signing Keys or Compromised Supplier Firmware

• Objective: Obtain a genuine signing certificate or exploit a backdoor.
• Examples: FCA’s GPEC2 leaked key (2018), Nissan bootloader bypass.
• Reality: This is the most practical—but rare and illegal without authorization.

Summary

Even assuming full hardware teardown and memory dumps, you cannot flash unsigned or altered binaries because the digital signature validation will block boot. Unless you:

• Extract the private signing key (nearly impossible),
• Find a firmware-level vulnerability, or
• Obtain a signed custom OS through a backchannel,

...there is no path to write arbitrary calibrations using HP Tuners or similar tools.



If this is part of a legitimate research proposal (e.g., academic, OEM, or cybersecurity lab), a proper approach would be:

1. Partner with an authorized lab (e.g., NCC Group, IOActive).
2. Work under NDA with Ford or Tier 1s.
3. Use instrumented ECUs on a dev bench with security researcher carve-outs.

Would you like a theoretical architecture flowchart of how Ford's secure boot works from a research standpoint?

Get this shit out of here.

 

[ZXMustang]

Get this shit out of here.

What shit? Facts? You don’t think I’m a bot do you? Would a bot call you a retard? Because you are.

 

[Puddinpop]

What shit? Facts? You don’t think I’m a bot do you? Would a bot call you a retard? Because you are.

I don't think anybody cares about "your" AI breakdowns.

 

[ZXMustang]

I don't think anybody cares about "your" AI breakdowns.

yeah because this thread is just full of facts otherwise. lol. Nobody cares because they’d rather bicker endlessly with hearsay from monkey mechanic tuners who have no idea what they are talking about or even what’s involved. But hey carry on folks. Just keep praying and maybe that will “crack the code” lol.

 

[Puddinpop]

yeah because this thread is just full of facts otherwise. lol. Nobody cares because they’d rather bicker endlessly with hearsay from monkey mechanic tuners who have no idea what they are talking about or even what’s involved. But hey carry on folks. Just keep praying and maybe that will “crack the code” lol.

To be fair I'd put more faith in the people working on these cars than I would some random person in a thread quoting their AI every chance they get. This isn't the first time you've put your "Ford trained" AI stuff in a thread.

 

[ZXMustang]

To be fair I'd put more faith in the people working on these cars than I would some random person in a thread quoting their AI every chance they get. This isn't the first time you've put your "Ford trained" AI stuff in a thread.

you have no idea what it even is. There are thousands of pages of ford coyote service manuals, HP tuners calibration manuals, SCT, COBB, industry ford tuning manuals, FORSCAN guides and asbuilt data, FDRS ford tech white papers. I’m talking like 20,000+ pages of information as well as web accessible ford tuning data it’s been trained on. Hundreds of hours of work has been put in. Forget about the hardware costs. There isn’t a person or group of persons on this or any other planet with the breadth of knowledge this AI has in these specific topics.
So please spare me your opinions. Until you understand the scope of what I have here, all you have is a shitty opinion about AI from what you’ve heard on Facebook or some other social media platform.
This isn’t your kids AI doing their math homework. This is how real number crunching and complex problems are handled in the actual real world.

 

[ShadowCoyote]

What shit? Facts? You don’t think I’m a bot do you? Would a bot call you a retard? Because you are.

We have enough answers as to why we can’t tune S650s. Don’t need your “personalized ai” trash.

 

[ZXMustang]

We have enough answers as to why we can’t tune S650s. Don’t need your “personalized ai” trash.

No you definitely don’t. You wouldn’t know what to do with any of it anyway. It’s far too complex for the average mustang owner. Just let the adults handle the heavy lifting and you’ll be able to enjoy the fruits of our labor soon enough.

 

[2BigPups]

It's so easy... the 0.01% of Mustang owners that want to "tune" their cars = nobody cares to put forth the effort to crack the new ECU. As if 500 hp is not enough to get your license suspended, lets go so much more. And void your warranty while you are at it.

For those that don't care about a warranty... your car will show up on carpart... which is why I will never, ever buy a used Mustang.

The reason used Mustangs have the reputation they do is because people read forums like this. Mod, mod, mod, mod, then why don't I have a decent trade in. Your desired mods, not the 0.01% of Mustangs owners, but the 0.0001% that want the exact same mods you wanted.

I would love to get another 2021 Mustang Mach 1 HP automatic. Unfortunately, all the cars I can find within 500 miles have been heavily modified. Yeah, nope, nope, nope, not dealing with an unknown installation.

SMH

 

[ShadowCoyote]

No you definitely don’t. You wouldn’t know what to do with any of it anyway. It’s far too complex for the average mustang owner. Just let the adults handle the heavy lifting and you’ll be able to enjoy the fruits of our labor soon enough.

Oh yes. I’m sure you’ll be the one to crack the code with your “ai”. Looking forward to it.

 

[kagemusha2662]

What shit? Facts? You don’t think I’m a bot do you? Would a bot call you a retard? Because you are.

Imagine getting this defensive over an AI 🫵
I’m gonna just say it straight, the people who are working on the algorithms you’re defending also find it weird and hilarious that people are this defensive about it. People who are using it this much like yourself are blind to the fact you yourself are making your own brain worse and making your own life invaluable not just in terms of career but social skills. Also facts is hilarious when many times AI is wrong

 

[Gregs24]

Another thread about to be locked having been taken over by the 5 year olds.....

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