Rant after driving a M2 and M3

[kagemusha2662]

I don't have their books and neither do you. But I do know GM and Stellantis couldn't make it work, so they decided they had to scrap it all together.

I don't care if you cry or not lol I have no stocks in ford or you.

You're acting like I owe you answers lmao Go buy another car. I promise you it doesn't matter to me

Brother you’re the one trying to justify a price increase on a Mustang that makes no sense lol I already have the 2024 dark horse. You say you have no stocks in ford but you’re preaching like a shareholder talking about how increases in labor costs is gonna bring down the company. Sounds like something a stockholder would say because their positions are about to go down. Again, I hope ford sees this and rewards you with a GTD because this is some insane bootlicking

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[Mustang1987]

Brother you’re the one trying to justify a price increase on a Mustang that makes no sense lol I already have the 2024 dark horse. You say you have no stocks in ford but you’re preaching like a shareholder talking about how increases in labor costs is gonna bring down the company. Sounds like something a stockholder would say because their positions are about to go down. Again, I hope ford sees this and rewards you with a GTD because this is some insane bootlicking

I said increases in labor costs causes prices to rise. And they do. That's it. Period. Add that with inflation and boom, you have a higher priced car.

The explorer has had a similar rise within the last couple years. So it's not because there's no competition.

The mustang competition went away because they couldn't make the model work and it wasn't worth it for GM and Stellantis.

Everything else you think I am or think I mean is in your head.

 

[kagemusha2662]

I said increases in labor costs causes prices to rise. And they do. That's it. Period. Add that with inflation and boom, you have a higher priced car.

The explorer has had a similar rise within the last couple years. So it's not because there's no competition.

The mustang competition went away because they couldn't make the model work and it wasn't worth it for GM and Stellantis.

Everything else you think I am or think I mean is in your head.

And everyone has been saying that price increase is not in line with the price increase that it should be lol you’re acting like you’re just an innocent bystander, but you’ve been going on and on about how the union deal was awful and how it will destroy the business and cause layoffs. None of this is true, and you’re buying the corporate argument. All of this over a company making more money in one year than most businesses are worth in their entirety. It just tells me a lot when you place the blame immediately on the worker wage increase and on consumers rather than corporate greed. When there’s no competition, a business’s first step is to monopolize the market and create insane profits for themselves. Explain to me as a business owner why you would change your product to market to an entirely different customer base when you can just keep making the same product but charge more because no one else is offering it? The answer is you would do the latter because it will make you more money. And that’s exactly what is happening here. If your argument about how they’re targeting higher cost car market is the route, then they would have made changes to the car to do that. All they did was increase the price to get there without doing anything to make the car actually better or compete with the cars in that tier in terms of luxury

 

[AdrenalDestruction]

So much sass! Fun!
Just some gee whiz thoughts:
-No one here is arguing with even a majority of the variables in mind, and certainly not all of them
-Higher 25’ price (announcement) may well drive additional 24’ sales
-Most Mustang drivers aren’t nerds on a forum (I include myself in this, don’t get all riled up)
-The auto industry is based on dishonesty at the dealer level that capitalizes on FOMO, keeping up with the Jones’, and generally bad decision making — more people will spend the extra than will not
-We left an arguably “better” car for the Mustang; a base model that I am building to our liking. Salient point: subjectivity is the word of the hour
-While no offense is intended, I will say that I am yet to meet someone who both has experience in ownership/payroll that blindly says “pay more or you deserve to fail.” If it were that simple, there’d be far fewer employees and substantially more bosses.

Lastly… everything is overpriced and we’re all screwed anyway. Go buy some go-fast parts and enjoy the ride while we’re able.

 

[Mustang1987]

And everyone has been saying that price increase is not in line with the price increase that it should be lol you’re acting like you’re just an innocent bystander, but you’ve been going on and on about how the union deal was awful and how it will destroy the business and cause layoffs. None of this is true, and you’re buying the corporate argument. All of this over a company making more money in one year than most businesses are worth in their entirety. It just tells me a lot when you place the blame immediately on the worker wage increase and on consumers rather than corporate greed. When there’s no competition, a business’s first step is to monopolize the market and create insane profits for themselves. Explain to me as a business owner why you would change your product to market to an entirely different customer base when you can just keep making the same product but charge more because no one else is offering it? The answer is you would do the latter because it will make you more money. And that’s exactly what is happening here. If your argument about how they’re targeting higher cost car market is the route, then they would have made changes to the car to do that. All they did was increase the price to get there without doing anything to make the car actually better or compete with the cars in that tier in terms of luxury

I didn't say any of that. I said it would cause prices to rise and inflation will also.

You said people will just buy the cheaper foreign ones. And I said since youre such a staunch supporter of the deal you should be willing to pay the increases.

I don't care what you buy either way.

I'm telling you that companies aren't going to eat the higher costs of labor and inflation. They pass it on.

That's how everything works.

 

[Mustang1987]

So much sass! Fun!
Just some gee whiz thoughts:
-No one here is arguing with even a majority of the variables in mind, and certainly not all of them
-Higher 25’ price (announcement) may well drive additional 24’ sales
-Most Mustang drivers aren’t nerds on a forum (I include myself in this, don’t get all riled up)
-The auto industry is based on dishonesty at the dealer level that capitalizes on FOMO, keeping up with the Jones’, and generally bad decision making — more people will spend the extra than will not
-We left an arguably “better” car for the Mustang; a base model that I am building to our liking. Salient point: subjectivity is the word of the hour
-While no offense is intended, I will say that I am yet to meet someone who both has experience in ownership/payroll that blindly says “pay more or you deserve to fail.” If it were that simple, there’d be far fewer employees and substantially more bosses.

Lastly… everything is overpriced and we’re all screwed anyway. Go buy some go-fast parts and enjoy the ride while we’re able.

All true!

It is also true that higher 2025 prices will drive 2024 sales and that is a real tactic.

 

[kagemusha2662]

I didn't say any of that. I said it would cause prices to rise and inflation will also.

You said people will just buy the cheaper foreign ones. And I said since youre such a staunch supporter of the deal you should be willing to pay the increases.

I don't care what you buy either way.

I'm telling you that companies aren't going to eat the higher costs of labor and inflation. They pass it on.

That's how everything works.

I would pay for a 2025 if it was priced correctly. It absolutely is not, especially considering what the above comment said about the predatory practice of dealerships. The 2025 is not priced correctly after inflation and wage increases. If it were, you wouldn’t be seeing anyone complain about it.

 

[Radiant]

It's funny, the ones complaining about the prices loved the recent union deal. It's almost poetic lol

Excerpt from an article...
"– Raises from at Least 33% to Over 160% – Over the life of the agreement, members will see raises of at least 33%, after COLA and compounded wage increases, ranging up to over 160% for some of the lowest-paid workers. Tens of thousands of autoworkers will see immediate raises of over 40% upon ratification."

There's your price increase.

Ford Motor company handed their shareholders over $716 million as a special dividend in Q1 2024, you seem to have conveniently "forgotten" that in your cost calculations. Of course, no one thing alone makes a car expensive: blaming the workers, or the shareholders, alone is pure politics.

Corporations are profit taking, that's why prices have gone up faster-than-inflation. This is literally MBA year one material: "never waste a crisis". Post-pandemic, corporations are market testing demand elasticity. They want to front-load price increases while they can, as future markets might not tolerate a price change.

 

[kagemusha2662]

Ford Motor company handed their shareholders over $716 million as a special dividend in Q1 2024, you seem to have conveniently "forgotten" that in your cost calculations. Of course, no one thing alone makes a car expensive: blaming the workers, or the shareholders, alone is pure politics.

Corporations are profit taking, that's why prices have gone up faster-than-inflation. This is literally MBA year one material: "never waste a crisis". Post-pandemic, corporations are market testing demand elasticity. They want to front-load price increases while they can, future markets might not tolerate them as well.

He has no argument against this

 

[BoostRabbitGT]

Has there ever been a period where car prices have gone down from the previous year, even if only for a year or two?

 

[kagemusha2662]

Has there ever been a period where car prices have gone down from the previous year, even if only for a year or two?

Don’t think so as car prices should increase (as most things) due to just normal inflation. What you’re seeing these days are companies taking advantage of that and using it as an excuse to raise prices to an extreme extent

 

[Mustang1987]

Ford Motor company handed their shareholders over $716 million as a special dividend in Q1 2024, you seem to have conveniently "forgotten" that in your cost calculations. Of course, no one thing alone makes a car expensive: blaming the workers, or the shareholders, alone is pure politics.

Corporations are profit taking, that's why prices have gone up faster-than-inflation. This is literally MBA year one material: "never waste a crisis". Post-pandemic, corporations are market testing demand elasticity. They want to front-load price increases while they can, as future markets might not tolerate a price change.

They're going to keep the same profit margins no matter what. They're not going to eat costs. They pass it on. I've been saying this since my first post.

 

[kagemusha2662]

They're going to keep the same profit margins no matter what. They're not going to eat costs. They pass it on. I've been saying this since my first post.

Ya and everyone has been saying that’s absolutely gross and ford should be called out for it. Customers absolutely should not buy the 2025 at all.

 

[Mustang1987]

Ya and everyone has been saying that’s absolutely gross and ford should be called out for it. Customers absolutely should not buy the 2025 at all.

No company is going to eat the cost. Not one. The cost will always get passed on.

 

[Radiant]

No company is going to eat the cost. Not one. The cost will always get passed on.

Workers want money. Shareholders want money. Mining and refining companies want money. Everyone wants money. So it goes. As long as the velocity of money remains high you can get away with passing on costs. Of course you can't squeeze blood from a turnip, so if you run out of customers with money, profit margins get cut.

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