DarkHorse/GT/ PowerPoint chatter

[Junkyard Dog]

https://parts.levittownfordparts.co...VUV97bN4HyJiDAD-20pZuGIrOzyaUsaUUnQRWj2kXv5BB

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[ChitownStang]

And?

https://performanceparts.ford.com/part/M-6007-M50DAUTO

It’s a different part #

 

[Junkyard Dog]

LOL, yes. It is. Probably has some different parts.

But there is an entire list of AI generated slop with no way to check and the few hyperlinked footnotes not backing up what is claimed.


I am not on the "everything is the same but the tune" train. But I would like some substantiation for the claims being made.

A different part number does not tell us really much of anything.

 

[DuckDodgersUK]

	Mustang GT	Mustang Dark Horse
Engine	5.0L Gen-4 Coyote V8	Modified 5.0L Gen-4 Coyote V8
Power	486 hp	500 hp
Torque	418 lb-ft / 567 Nm	418 lb-ft / 567 Nm
Manual gearbox	MT82-D4 6-speed	Tremec TR-3160 6-speed
Automatic	10-speed	10-speed
Manual rear axle	3.73:1 with Performance Pack	3.73:1 Torsen
MagneRide	Optional	Standard
Front brakes	Brembo 6-piston with Performance Pack	Brembo 6-piston, larger rotors
Engine	Standard Coyote	Modified/high-output Coyote
Intake	GT system	Unique high-performance intake manifold/dual intake
Connecting rods	Standard	Forged connecting rods
No-lift shifting	No	Yes
Rev matching	Yes	Yes
Track mode	Yes	Yes, with Dark Horse-specific calibration
Drift brake	Optional	Available/standard depending on equipment
Suspension	Standard GT / optional MagneRide	Dark Horse-specific tuning + MagneRide
Aero	GT	Dark Horse-specific
Rear spoiler	Optional Performance Pack wing	Dark Horse spoiler
Exhaust	Active Performance optional	Active Performance standard
Seats	GT sports seats	Recaro Micro-Suede standard
Wheels	19” GT Performance Pack	19” Dark Horse wheels

 

[Sofa King]

I do know that there are two different rods in the parts catalog... other than that...?

Nice work...

 

[Aggie1999]

Ok, I'm by no means the mechanic or have the "inside knowledge" that other people her have, so this is just my 2 cents.

A number of years ago I helped an uncle of mine rebuild a '69 Mach 1 and a number of the parts we used were identical to parts off of a similar year F150, but just different parts number and 5x the cost. So just because they have different parts numbers doesn't necessarily mean that they aren't the exact same part. So unless someone can provide more than "well they have different parts numbers" I'm still not sold that they aren't the same part with the same metal treatment.

But I've been wrong before, but only once.

 

[AZ_Ryan]

LOL, yes. It is. Probably has some different parts.

But there is an entire list of AI generated slop with no way to check and the few hyperlinked footnotes not backing up what is claimed.


I a not on the "everything is the same but the tune" train. But I would like some substantiation for the claims being made.

A different part number does not tell us really much of anything.

I agree. Cutting and pasting from other forums or using AI is how a lot of misinformation regarding the DH got started to begin with.

I would also suggest including sources when citing info. Otherwise this is just an exercise in hearsay.

And for the record, I'm not on the "everything is the same train" either. But different part numbers don't tell the whole story. And I for one would like to know, without speculation.

As for the connecting rods, those seem to be the one thing that is universally known to be different. I dont believe it has ever been disputed they are the GT500 rods.

 

[Junkyard Dog]

• The Camshafts (Physically Different): The Dark Horse camshafts are strengthened for track durability and feature completely different part numbers than the GT cams. They are uniquely engineered with different lobe profiles to change the intake and exhaust duration, allowing the engine to breathe better and safely hold its power up to its 7,500 RPM redline. [1, 2, 3, 5]
• The Rocker Arms & Valvetrain Geometry (Physically Different): The cylinder heads feature a revised casting with specialized geometry. The valve springs are stiffer, and the rocker arms are modified with a higher ratio (similar to what Ford engineered for the track-focused Shelby GT350). These are not shared with the standard GT. [1, 2]

So let's start with these valve train things.

Camshafts.

Are they different? This says they are strengthened and have different lobe profiles. If you click on the hyperlinked notes, 1, 2, 3, and 5, however, there is nothing to support those claims.

This does not mean that the claims are not true. This does not mean that the claims are true. This just means that there is zero support presented for the claim.

The rocker arms and valvetrain geometry - cylinder heads have revised casting with specialized geometry (who writes like this? AI algorithms, that's who). The rocker arms have a higher ratio, too. Notes 1 and 2 supposedly support this claim. But do they? Click on them. Is there any support for these claims?

1 is a dealership marketing page which says "strengthened camshafts." It does not say how they are strengthened or frankly give any information to permit an evaluation of the claim. Maybe it is true. Maybe it is just marketing fluff. What did Ford do to strengthen the camshafts?

2 is the same as 1. Literally the same.

Neither one says anything about higher ratio rocker arms.

Again, a lack of support does not mean that the claims are not true. But it does mean you will have to find some other confirmation for the claim.

 

[AZ_Ryan]

Ok, I'm by no means the mechanic or have the "inside knowledge" that other people her have, so this is just my 2 cents.

A number of years ago I helped an uncle of mine rebuild a '69 Mach 1 and a number of the parts we used were identical to parts off of a similar year F150, but just different parts number and 5x the cost. So just because they have different parts numbers doesn't necessarily mean that they aren't the exact same part. So unless someone can provide more than "well they have different parts numbers" I'm still not sold that they aren't the same part with the same metal treatment.

But I've been wrong before, but only once.

Agreed. Different part numbers on the crank and cam could just simply point to different balancing as well.

 

[Junkyard Dog]

If the rods are different, then the balancing is going to be different.

They could have also taken more time to balance to some sort of closer tolerance, but we are just speculating, guessing. We have no earthly idea what they did, if they did it, and how they did it if they did.

 

[Junkyard Dog]

It would be great to have somebody in engineering that worked on developing the Dark Horse engine chime in with the real deal.

 

[SR5BART]

I’ll leave this here for what it’s worth

I’ve been with Toyota since 2012 on the service end

The same exact part will carry 2 different part numbers wether it’s customer pay or warranty

I’m sure Ford plays the same game

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