Best Track Tires?

[D/\rK•650]

I have 2025 Dark Horse 10 speed w/o the handing package. I drive it almost exclusively on the track and love it! I'm running Michelin Sport Cup 2 315/30/19 and they only last 2 days at the track. Great tires but ouch the price. Anybody recommend a similar more economical track tire? I can't adjust the camber yet but fixing that soon and hoping some negative camber will get me at least another day on the track before the tires wear out. Comments??? Thanks!!!

Check out these, there not as good as some but price wise there not to bad. They will not perform as good as the more expensive options but might be worth a try.

Kenda Vezda UHP/MAX (KR20A) Racing P315/30ZR19 104W XL Passenger Tire, Kenda Vezda UHP MAX Summer (KR20A) Racing 305/30ZR19 102W XL Passenger Tire

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[Junkyard Dog]

On our HPDE cars - we run the following set-up:

• Steeda Wheel/Tire Upgrades:
• Steeda Trident Satin Black Square HPDE Wheel Package - 19x11
• Hoosier Track Attack 200 Tread Wear Track Tires(325-30-19)
• Steeda 1" Hubcentric Billet Aluminum Wheel Spacer - Pair

You can reach out to Rodney at 1800 950 0774 - he's our resident on-track expert & can guide you to on-site track success!

Thanks for posting that.

Wow, an 11 inch wheel and a 325 tire up front? They actually fit with no rubbing on a high speed uphill turn pulling 1.2 Gs or when running over a kerb?

Even for the slightly lower handling package Dark Horses?

That 325 Hoosier tire is 11.2" tread width and 26.9" tire height.

Is there maybe any advantage to running the slightly smaller 315 or 305 to get the tread width down to slightly narrower than the wheel width? The 305 is almost the same height as the original Dark Horse handling package tires, at 26.4" (Trofeo RS are 26.6" front with 9.8" tread width and and 26.5" rear with 10.5" tread width) and has 10.2" tread width. Tire Rack does not list the tire height for the Hoosier 315, so I could not compare it, but Tire Rack states that it also has 10.2" tread width (weird, huh? lol @ tire companies and their sizing).

Here is what I am babbling on about, slightly narrower tread width compared to wheel width results in reduced lap times in every test I have (so far) seen:
https://grassrootsmotorsports.com/articles/wheel-width-is-wider-always-better/

 

[Michael49]

What is this about a notice on the dashboard that the Dark Horse is now untethered?

I searches 'what does untethered refer to on Mustang Dark Horse and got a lengthy explanation. Try that, interesting

 

[Michael49]

Check out these, there not as good as some but price wise there not to bad. They will not perform as good as the more expensive options but might be worth a try.

Kenda Vezda UHP/MAX (KR20A) Racing P315/30ZR19 104W XL Passenger Tire, Kenda Vezda UHP MAX Summer (KR20A) Racing 305/30ZR19 102W XL Passenger Tire

Thanks

 

[Junkyard Dog]

I searches 'what does untethered refer to on Mustang Dark Horse and got a lengthy explanation. Try that, interesting

I used those words, and nothing useful or even relevant appeared. Maybe I am searching incorrectly somehow.

 

[Garcia172]

R compound tires. Do your research.

Stay away from used slicks. While they sound tempting, you'll be chasing your setup because the next set of used slicks (even if the same make/model) will perform differently. That's why we never setup race cars on used slicks. Too inconsistent. And they will never perform anywhere near a new slick. Remember once up to operating temps, they are only good for a max of 30-45 min before they get hard and your lap times go up. And... that's the reason that race cars are much faster on new tires and why they pit and change the tires (it's not because they are worn out. Not even close... they are hard).

 

[Michael49]

Thanks for posting that.

Wow, an 11 inch wheel and a 325 tire up front? They actually fit with no rubbing on a high speed uphill turn pulling 1.2 Gs or when running over a kerb?

Even for the slightly lower handling package Dark Horses?

That 325 Hoosier tire is 11.2" tread width and 26.9" tire height.

Is there maybe any advantage to running the slightly smaller 315 or 305 to get the tread width down to slightly narrower than the wheel width? The 305 is almost the same height as the original Dark Horse handling package tires, at 26.4" (Trofeo RS are 26.6" front with 9.8" tread width and and 26.5" rear with 10.5" tread width) and has 10.2" tread width. Tire Rack does not list the tire height for the Hoosier 315, so I could not compare it, but Tire Rack states that it also has 10.2" tread width (weird, huh? lol @ tire companies and their sizing).

Here is what I am babbling on about, slightly narrower tread width compared to wheel width results in reduced lap times in every test I have (so far) seen:
https://grassrootsmotorsports.com/articles/wheel-width-is-wider-always-better/

Well.....ummm.... Haha you picked that up immediately. In fact they did rub. Long story but took it to the shop and they ordered coil over adjustable camber system that didn't fit. I picked the car up while I waited for the correct one to come in and took it to the track and it did rub. Slightly impatient nature and I not wanting to miss any track days. The new system is in place and the car had to be raised,unfortunately, to keep them from rubbing. One of the next projects during the slower winter track season is to put fender flares so I can lower it back down again. Taking it to The track in Spokane Sept 20 and Oregon Raceway Park on 22nd Thanks for the great feedback and information, very much appreciated.

 

[Michael49]

R compound tires. Do your research.

Stay away from used slicks. While they sound tempting, you'll be chasing your setup because the next set of used slicks (even if the same make/model) will perform differently. That's why we never setup race cars on used slicks. Too inconsistent. And they will never perform anywhere near a new slick. Remember once up to operating temps, they are only good for a max of 30-45 min before they get hard and your lap times go up. And... that's the reason that race cars are much faster on new tires and why they pit and change the tires (it's not because they are worn out. Not even close... they are hard).

I can't tell you how much I appreciate this. I'm getting an invaluable education. Thanks

 

[Michael49]

I used those words, and nothing useful or even relevant appeared. Maybe I am searching incorrectly somehow.

Google can definitely be inconsistent frustrating sometimes. Luckily I still had it open this is what I read which I found interesting.
The phrase "untethered" in reference to a Mustang Dark Horse is not a specific, official vehicle mode or feature. Instead, it is used metaphorically by enthusiasts and marketing to describe the car's ultimate, unconstrained performance.
This usage of the word "untethered" signifies a car that is no longer held back by the various electronic assists and road-oriented settings meant for everyday driving. In this context, it implies that the driver is experiencing the Mustang Dark Horse's raw, unbridled power and performance, typically on a closed course or racetrack.

 

[Michael49]

-The work on resolving our Dark Horse Automatic Transmission overheating issue is almost complete. Our recorded best lap from earlier this year at Sonoma Raceway, on the 2.52-mile configuration, was a 1:43.3 on the 5th heat cycle, using Toyo RR 295/30/19 tires, square, mounted on handling package wheels. Our car is a base model with correct front adjustable camber plates from Ford Performance.

-This was a laid-back lap, short shifting at 6,000rpm and only using 5th, 6th, and 7th gears. This gentle driving approach was necessary to prevent the automatic transmission from going into the red and causing the car to enter limp mode.

-NEARLY COMPLETE WORK on the 10-speed automatic quasi handling package base model.
1. Removed both Cats and replaced them with equal-length headers purchased from Beef Cake Racing. (The cats were sandwiching the transmission and could reach 1,600 degrees, and were darkly discolored from excessive heat.) LTH claims a potential gain of up to 70 hp from their high-performance track-only headers.
2. Removed the thermostat valve that only opens at 180 degrees to allow transmission fluid to flow through the air-to-fluid auxiliary transmission cooler.
3. Removed the OME air-to-fluid auxiliary transmission cooler and replaced it with a larger one with a 650cfm fan and mounted it with custom-fabricated aluminum brackets tied to existing bolt holes from the factory and positioned it in front of the AC condenser radiator coil, which is located in front of the engine coolant radiator and fan.
4. Installed a transmission cooler fan “switch” inside the driver's cockpit, which will be flipped on as soon as we fire up the engine on pit road.
5. Lastly, we are replacing the two OME cone-shaped air filters with the blue Steeda ones that they claim improve torque by +2lbf-ft and +3hp throughout the entire rpm range during a 3rd gear pull on their dyno up to near 7,000rpm.

-In-car video of a Joe Gibbs Toyota with Kyle B. starting 8th(love him or hate him), as Kyle is lined up behind Joey L. in his Rodger Penske Mustang for the start on the 2.52-mile course, shows those top drivers consistently running a 1:39 laps from the beginning of the race. These are considerably fast laps, representing the high watermark for what a completely sorted stock car with new sticker slicks and a skilled driver can achieve.

-We primarily drive this same 2.52-mile Sonoma Raceway course configuration, which most clubs use during their HPDE, featuring the carousel and fast 7. All Mustangs are welcome, even by The Golden Gate Lotus Club(who are a super laid-back group).

Wow this is great, I really appreciate you sharing this all information

 

[Michael49]

What wheels are you running?

I'm running 11 inch squared I can't think of the make right now

 

[Deleted member 64156]

Thanks for posting that.

Wow, an 11 inch wheel and a 325 tire up front? They actually fit with no rubbing on a high speed uphill turn pulling 1.2 Gs or when running over a kerb?

Even for the slightly lower handling package Dark Horses?

That 325 Hoosier tire is 11.2" tread width and 26.9" tire height.

Is there maybe any advantage to running the slightly smaller 315 or 305 to get the tread width down to slightly narrower than the wheel width? The 305 is almost the same height as the original Dark Horse handling package tires, at 26.4" (Trofeo RS are 26.6" front with 9.8" tread width and and 26.5" rear with 10.5" tread width) and has 10.2" tread width. Tire Rack does not list the tire height for the Hoosier 315, so I could not compare it, but Tire Rack states that it also has 10.2" tread width (weird, huh? lol @ tire companies and their sizing).

Here is what I am babbling on about, slightly narrower tread width compared to wheel width results in reduced lap times in every test I have (so far) seen:
https://grassrootsmotorsports.com/articles/wheel-width-is-wider-always-better/

We are achieving 1.59 Gs in the braking zones, as well as in both left- and right-hand turns.

 

[Junkyard Dog]

We are achieving 1.59 Gs in the braking zones, as well as in both left- and right-hand turns.

But you are running a Toyo RR in 295/30/19 on the original Dark Horse handling package 10.5" wheel, right? That should not have any problems with rubbing.

 

[Junkyard Dog]

What is this about a notice on the dashboard that the Dark Horse is now untethered?

OK, so in post 14, there is a lengthy attachment in which you describe shaving 4 seconds, a world of time, off of your lap time when you put 100 octane in the tank.


But you also recommend to the OP that he seriously consider Toyo R888R, so yuck. I do not know anybody who has run different tires recommending that, and it comes in toward the bottom in every lap time comparison.

 

[Michael49]

But you are running a Toyo RR in 296/30/19 on the original Dark Horse handling package 10.5" wheel, right? That should not have any problems with rubbing.

No, actually I changed to 11" wheels square and I'm running Michelin Sport Cup 2 315/30/19 square. It was a noticable change in increased corner traction

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