Dark Horse poorly received??

[GripTime]

I see a significant difference between the GT & DH. The DH is the next generation of magneride engineering from the GT350 and Mach 1 and that's a good thing! This engineering is in the handling which is why I bought the car. The DH not only has upgraded suspension parts but the suspension has been tuned to maximize these upgrades. That's why I love the magneride technology, it can be maximized to each car. This is akin to an engine tune after adding a CAI. Again, track numbers for the GT with magneride, Mach 1, GT350, GT500 & DH back up this engineering time and time again. And more importantly, the engaging fun factor of these cars and how they handle.

Here is the best side by side comparison I have ever found for the two cars.

https://www.cjponyparts.com/resources/mustang-gt-vs-dark-horse

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[Polo08816]

I think the problem with the DH is that a DH with the HP and Recaro seats has an MSRP of ~$72,000 and there's less supply of it than the G87 M2 that has an MSRP of $65,000 and more supply. Then you have the C8 Z51 that MSRPs slightly below $80,000 but the plentiful supply means that you'll likely get one at invoice.

The DH with HP and Recaro seats is sandwiched right into no-man's land.

 

[Ryunker]

So reading all of these posts, DH (majority) better car, but higher price tag and less availability. In reality Ford was successful in every aspect of designing and releasing the DH. Great car.

In many cases, consumers settle for the GT due to budget constraints along with availability. In the long run, I think after folks modify their GT's more money will be spent on those than the MSRP of the DH, and yet still won't ever be the DH.

No shame to the ton of consumers that choose the Ecoboost or GT Mustangs, as always for the past 60 years there are Mustangs for literally everyone on every budget. Speaking for myself owning some in every generation with exception of two, my favorites have always been the 6 and 4 cylinder models. Always been partial to the convertibles. Currently in the stables reside a '71 Mach1, 2013 convertible in grabber blue 3.7l manual followed up with the DH. Each one of those are kept for specific reasons.

 

[Polo08816]

So reading all of these posts, DH (majority) better car, but higher price tag and less availability. In reality Ford was successful in every aspect of designing and releasing the DH. Great car.

In many cases, consumers settle for the GT due to budget constraints along with availability. In the long run, I think after folks modify their GT's more money will be spent on those than the MSRP of the DH, and yet still won't ever be the DH.

No shame to the ton of consumers that choose the Ecoboost or GT Mustangs, as always for the past 60 years there are Mustangs for literally everyone on every budget. Speaking for myself owning some in every generation with exception of two, my favorites have always been the 6 and 4 cylinder models. Always been partial to the convertibles. Currently in the stables reside a '71 Mach1, 2013 convertible in grabber blue 3.7l manual followed up with the DH. Each one of those are kept for specific reasons.

Agreed, particularly from a track/HPDE perspective. 10-20 second pulls don't place the same type of stress on a vehicle compared to a 20-40 min session driving the car at 9/10ths or 10/10ths. It's been my experience that the overall cost of a M2 (versus M240i) and M3 (versus M340i) will be less while having better durability/reliability.

 

[Zengineer]

I see a significant difference between the GT & DH. The DH is the next generation of magneride engineering from the GT350 and Mach 1 and that's a good thing! This engineering is in the handling which is why I bought the car. The DH not only has upgraded suspension parts but the suspension has been tuned to maximize these upgrades. That's why I love the magneride technology, it can be maximized to each car. This is akin to an engine tune after adding a CAI. Again, track numbers for the GT with magneride, Mach 1, GT350, GT500 & DH back up this engineering time and time again. And more importantly, the engaging fun factor of these cars and how they handle.

Here is the best side by side comparison I have ever found for the two cars.

https://www.cjponyparts.com/resources/mustang-gt-vs-dark-horse

I'm not sure when that article was originally written but it was supposedly updated recently. Isn't the statement about Recaro seats being standard in a Dark Horse just plain wrong?

Ford did a decent job with the 2024, but I think we're going to find in 2026 that the Dark Horse isn't the king of the S650 hill. There is more to come...much more.

 

[Skye]

I feel it's not so much being received poorly as it is debuting with multiple headwinds (listed in no particular order):

- Consumers as a whole in the US are not confident in their current financial situation

- The transition from the S197 to the S550 was huge. The cars, fundamentally different. The change from S550 to S650? Not so much

- Looking at price vs. performance and depending on driver intent, a car in another trim or S550 might be a better buy

- The S650 cannot (currently) be tuned. The 7G will be supported by Ford-sponsored third parties, but performance aftermarket possibilities remain a question mark

- Trucks and SUVs are big now. Big in sales. Big in price. Customers prefer trucks and SUVs. Ford wants to sell more because the profit margins are greater

- We're one year into the next generation. Some potential buyers might be cautious, waiting for their concerns (recalls, TSBs) to be worked out

- Ford continues to wrestle with parts availability, supply issues and build constraints

- The S550 just completed a nine-year run. There are hundreds of thousands out there, many available in great form, some still new

- EVs aren't going away. How well Dodge's performance-oriented offerings sell remains to be seen, but it's an additional pressure on everyone else

- Ford's marketing division hasn't expressed a lot of enthusiasm. The reveal was not well-planned and seemed forced at times. Videos of Ford drives and reviews are more someone putting around than pushing the car to its limits

- Asian and now EUR imports will continue to exert even greater pressure on US performance coupe sales

 

[roadpilot]

Ford did a decent job with the 2024, but I think we're going to find in 2026 that the Dark Horse isn't the king of the S650 hill. There is more to come...much more.

There is always more to come. But I'd rather enjoy my DH while waiting for the "what ifs" to materialize.

 

[Polo08816]

I believe it's not so much as being received poorly as much as it has debuted facing multiple headwinds (listed in no particular order):

- Consumers as a whole in the US are not confident in their current financial situation

- The transition from the S197 to the S550 was huge. The differences, fundamentally different. The change from S550 to S650? Not so much

- Looking at price vs. performance and depending on driver intent, a car in another trim or S550 might be a better buy

- The S650 cannot (currently) be tuned. The 7G will be supported by Ford-sponsored third parties, but performance aftermarket possibilities remain a question mark

- Trucks and SUVs are big now. Big in sales. Big in price. Customers prefer trucks and SUVs. Ford wants to sell more because the profit margins are greater

- We're one year into the next generation. Some potential buyers might be cautious, waiting for their concerns (recalls, TSBs) to be worked out

- Ford continues to wrestle with parts availability, supply issues and build constraints

- The S550 just completed a nine-year run. There are hundreds of thousands out there, many available in great form, some still new

- EVs aren't going away. How well Dodge's performance-oriented offerings sell remains to be seen, but it's another additional pressure on everyone else

- Ford's marketing division hasn't expressed a lot of enthusiasm. The reveal was not well-planned and seemed forced at times. Videos of Ford drives and reviews are more someone putting around than pushing the car to its limits

- Asian and now EUR imports will continue to exert even greater pressure on US performance coupe sales

In my opinion, the DH needed to be priced below the G87 M2.

 

[roadpilot]

I believe it's not so much as being received poorly as much as it has debuted facing multiple headwinds (listed in no particular order):

- Consumers as a whole in the US are not confident in their current financial situation

- The transition from the S197 to the S550 was huge. The differences, fundamentally different. The change from S550 to S650? Not so much

- Looking at price vs. performance and depending on driver intent, a car in another trim or S550 might be a better buy

- The S650 cannot (currently) be tuned. The 7G will be supported by Ford-sponsored third parties, but performance aftermarket possibilities remain a question mark

- Trucks and SUVs are big now. Big in sales. Big in price. Customers prefer trucks and SUVs. Ford wants to sell more because the profit margins are greater

- We're one year into the next generation. Some potential buyers might be cautious, waiting for their concerns (recalls, TSBs) to be worked out

- Ford continues to wrestle with parts availability, supply issues and build constraints

- The S550 just completed a nine-year run. There are hundreds of thousands out there, many available in great form, some still new

- EVs aren't going away. How well Dodge's performance-oriented offerings sell remains to be seen, but it's another additional pressure on everyone else

- Ford's marketing division hasn't expressed a lot of enthusiasm. The reveal was not well-planned and seemed forced at times. Videos of Ford drives and reviews are more someone putting around than pushing the car to its limits

- Asian and now EUR imports will continue to exert even greater pressure on US performance coupe sales

All excellent points, @Skye.

 

[roadpilot]

In my opinion, the DH needed to be priced below the G87 M2.

2024 DH base price $62,180.
2024 M2 base price $63,200

 

[Polo08816]

2024 DH base price $62,180.
2024 M2 base price $63,200

You need a DH Premium with HP and Recaros to be comparable. The MSRP for that is ~$72k.

 

[Zengineer]

There is always more to come. But I'd rather enjoy my DH while waiting for the "what ifs" to materialize.

Agreed. I see you had a '14 GT. My GT experience goes back to the carburated '85 manual, but my favorite was my '13 California Special.

 

[roadpilot]

You need a DH Premium with HP and Recaros to be comparable. The MSRP for that is ~$72k.

The C&D article put the nicely equipped M2 @ $75K and some change.

 

[DukeCLR]

I was thinking about getting a DH but I wanted ventilated seats. It's hat simple, I also think that I would not have gotten the X-plan pricing either.

 

[roadpilot]

Agreed. I see you had a '14 GT. My GT experience goes back to the carburated '85 manual, but my favorite was my '13 California Special.

I had many Fox bodies, all manual and 5.0. Lost count of the number we converted from 4 cylinder autos to this. My 2012 was a manual 5.0, but I had to switch to an auto after a car/pedestrian assault cost me my left leg. So the '14 GT was a 5.0 auto. Loved that car ... shouldn't have sold it. But I keep in touch with the owner ... they take care of it but have turned down my annual offers to buy it back ... ;)

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