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48-volt/12-volt hybrid S650

lcbrownz

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Ford has previously stated they are working on electrifying some of their vehicles with a hybrid 48-volt/12-volt electrical system. Ford previously announced they are 2nd in North American electric vehicle sales (behind Tesla). This being said, shouldn't Ford being are already be performing the R&D work for the electrified Mustang?
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Bikeman315

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Ford has previously stated they are working on electrifying some of their vehicles with a hybrid 48-volt/12-volt electrical system. Ford previously announced they are 2nd in North American electric vehicle sales (behind Tesla). This being said, shouldn't Ford being are already be performing the R&D work for the electrified Mustang?
Who said they aren’t? I would say it is certainly possible that there could be a hybrid sometime before we see a 100% electric Mustang. I’d love to see one.
 
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lcbrownz

lcbrownz

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Who said they aren’t? I would say it is certainly possible that there could be a hybrid sometime before we see a 100% electric Mustang. I’d love to see one.
According to Auto Evolution website: ..."The new Mustang is expected to get a plug-in hybrid in 2025 according to leaked information. The info suggests that both engines will receive a hybrid treatment, being given an electric boost. One method that would allow this, would be the use of Ford’s Modular Hybrid Transmission (MHT), which is found in the hybrid version of the Ford Explorer and could be adapted to both engines"... That said, there should be someone, already showing concept drawings of the hybrid Mustang on-line.
 

Twin Turbo

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We've seen a Linkedin profile (subsequently deleted) that showed Ford were/are working on this.

There was also a V8 Hybrid patent from a few years ago, too.

I hope we do get to see this before a full-EV "S750"

S650 Mustang 48-volt/12-volt hybrid S650 s650 mustang hybrid powerplants
S650 Mustang 48-volt/12-volt hybrid S650 Hybrid Patent
 
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lcbrownz

lcbrownz

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We've seen a Linkedin profile (subsequently deleted) that showed Ford were/are working on this.

There was also a V8 Hybrid patent from a few years ago, too.

I hope we do get to see this before a full-EV "S750"

s650 mustang hybrid powerplants.png
Hybrid Patent.jpg
There is a reason why it was deleted. Ford went in another direction for its 48-volt/12-volt hybrid system. Ford requests patents all the time. Not for itself but to keep other manufacturers from patenting new manufacturing techniques Ford was working on.
 


Twin Turbo

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Well, the Linkedin profile didn't state what sort of hybrid was being tested. The fact the profile was pasted all over various motoring websites/forums/FB groups is more likely why it was deleted.
 

Evo1986

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I think a plug in hybrid for 2025 is a bit too optimistic, but i would welcome if the have the mild hybrid option with the 48 Volt battery, which gives more torque for acceleration and traction. The all new BMW X6M has it as well.

Being integrated in its Steptronic transmission it delivers up to 15BHP output and 200Nm (147 lb-ft) of torque which flows into a more rapid power delivery.

I was hoping thar Ford offered this in the MY'24 already, because they already have that technology built in some of the European models. Since the energy is being obtained by adaptive recuperation under braking, this motor works like a crankshaft-mounted starter generator.

My mum drives a mild hybrid Fiesta and comparing it with a normal engine, I could definitely tell a more responsive power delivery.
 

IceGamer

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I think a plug in hybrid for 2025 is a bit too optimistic, but i would welcome if the have the mild hybrid option with the 48 Volt battery, which gives more torque for acceleration and traction. The all new BMW X6M has it as well.

Being integrated in its Steptronic transmission it delivers up to 15BHP output and 200Nm (147 lb-ft) of torque which flows into a more rapid power delivery.

I was hoping thar Ford offered this in the MY'24 already, because they already have that technology built in some of the European models. Since the energy is being obtained by adaptive recuperation under braking, this motor works like a crankshaft-mounted starter generator.

My mum drives a mild hybrid Fiesta and comparing it with a normal engine, I could definitely tell a more responsive power delivery.
As far as I'm aware all 3 liter BMW engines have that mild-hybrid system. Diesel and petrol. I think that the term “hybrid” is somewhat misleading for unaware customers.

The mild-hybrid cannot be charged externally and one cannot drive purely on electricity. Besides, the electric motors do not enable AWD or anything since they are not powerful enough. The petrol engine does all the work. In addition, BMW stated back then (~2021) that they had to implement the system in order to reduce emissions. The power gains are minimal (barely noticeable) and all the system really does is to reduce emissions.

Now, if the system in a potential hybrid Mustang would offer more power I would be intrigued but as of right now the Mustang would benefit more from an AWD setup then it would from a mild-hybrid upgrade. I would love to see both come to fruition though :D
 

Evo1986

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As far as I'm aware all 3 liter BMW engines have that mild-hybrid system. Diesel and petrol. I think that the term “hybrid” is somewhat misleading for unaware customers.

The mild-hybrid cannot be charged externally and one cannot drive purely on electricity. Besides, the electric motors do not enable AWD or anything since they are not powerful enough. The petrol engine does all the work. In addition, BMW stated back then (~2021) that they had to implement the system in order to reduce emissions. The power gains are minimal (barely noticeable) and all the system really does is to reduce emissions.

Now, if the system in a potential hybrid Mustang would offer more power I would be intrigued but as of right now the Mustang would benefit more from an AWD setup then it would from a mild-hybrid upgrade. I would love to see both come to fruition though :D
I was assuming that you would answer as soon as I drop BMW lmao :D

Yes I know that you cannot charge the mild hybrid externally (didn't claim that), but it gives you a small boost at acceleration and traction. I think the figures I have mentioned speak for themselves.

Of course it is not a drastic change and you won't have a total new car with that aid, but I believe it is a nice to have and probably would have fitted the Mustang oh so well.
 

IceGamer

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I was assuming that you would answer as soon as I drop BMW lmao :D

Yes I know that you cannot charge the mild hybrid externally (didn't claim that), but it gives you a small boost at acceleration and traction. I think the figures I have mentioned speak for themselves.

Of course it is not a drastic change and you won't have a total new car with that aid, but I believe it is a nice to have and probably would have fitted the Mustang oh so well.
I don’t know if mild-hybrid systems really pay off. They do in terms of emissions and according to Ford EU there won’t be any non-hybrid cars after 2025. However, as a German I hoped for a more radical approach that would benefit me as a tax payer. Seeing Mercedes new “C63” hybrid is shameful. It’s a four banger with a heavy battery that can only accasionally use its full power. I don’t want that for the Mustang…

Unfortunately I doubt that we’ll see a plug-in-hybrid Mustang at all. Main reason is the power output. Every upcoming V8 plug-in-hybrid (M5, AMG GT63, next RS6 etc.) puts out north of 800 whp… Where do you place a Shelby or any other upmarket product? Adding the fact that the D2C platform is fairly old I assume that it would take a lot of time and money to implement a plug-in-hybrid system. Overall I don’t see the payoff in this segment. Huge investments into a small segment market isn’t something CEO’s like to do.

However, since there is a F150 hybrid the Mustang might get that setup. 1.5kWh lithium-ion battery and a 35kW electric motor might fit relatively easy into the chassis or the trunk. However, it’s not a plug-in and it is mostly beneficial to reduce emissions or to power tools and electronics. Same goes for the Maverick/Escape hybrid. It produces something around 80kW and increases the weight by roughly 500 pounds.

Long story short the Mustang will not get a newly invented setup. It’s either getting a slightly modified version of what is available in a high volume production car or isn’t getting anything at all.
 
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lcbrownz

lcbrownz

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I don’t know if mild-hybrid systems really pay off. They do in terms of emissions and according to Ford EU there won’t be any non-hybrid cars after 2025. However, as a German I hoped for a more radical approach that would benefit me as a tax payer. Seeing Mercedes new “C63” hybrid is shameful. It’s a four banger with a heavy battery that can only accasionally use its full power. I don’t want that for the Mustang…

Unfortunately I doubt that we’ll see a plug-in-hybrid Mustang at all. Main reason is the power output. Every upcoming V8 plug-in-hybrid (M5, AMG GT63, next RS6 etc.) puts out north of 800 whp… Where do you place a Shelby or any other upmarket product? Adding the fact that the D2C platform is fairly old I assume that it would take a lot of time and money to implement a plug-in-hybrid system. Overall I don’t see the payoff in this segment. Huge investments into a small segment market isn’t something CEO’s like to do.

However, since there is a F150 hybrid the Mustang might get that setup. 1.5kWh lithium-ion battery and a 35kW electric motor might fit relatively easy into the chassis or the trunk. However, it’s not a plug-in and it is mostly beneficial to reduce emissions or to power tools and electronics. Same goes for the Maverick/Escape hybrid. It produces something around 80kW and increases the weight by roughly 500 pounds.

Long story short the Mustang will not get a newly invented setup. It’s either getting a slightly modified version of what is available in a high volume production car or isn’t getting anything at all.
Lithium Ion batteries may have less than 10 years left in this energy cycle. The new batteries on the horizon are Lithium-Sulfur. Just more testing needs to be done on its long-term life expectancy.
 

Evo1986

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I don’t know if mild-hybrid systems really pay off. They do in terms of emissions and according to Ford EU there won’t be any non-hybrid cars after 2025. However, as a German I hoped for a more radical approach that would benefit me as a tax payer. Seeing Mercedes new “C63” hybrid is shameful. It’s a four banger with a heavy battery that can only accasionally use its full power. I don’t want that for the Mustang…

Unfortunately I doubt that we’ll see a plug-in-hybrid Mustang at all. Main reason is the power output. Every upcoming V8 plug-in-hybrid (M5, AMG GT63, next RS6 etc.) puts out north of 800 whp… Where do you place a Shelby or any other upmarket product? Adding the fact that the D2C platform is fairly old I assume that it would take a lot of time and money to implement a plug-in-hybrid system. Overall I don’t see the payoff in this segment. Huge investments into a small segment market isn’t something CEO’s like to do.

However, since there is a F150 hybrid the Mustang might get that setup. 1.5kWh lithium-ion battery and a 35kW electric motor might fit relatively easy into the chassis or the trunk. However, it’s not a plug-in and it is mostly beneficial to reduce emissions or to power tools and electronics. Same goes for the Maverick/Escape hybrid. It produces something around 80kW and increases the weight by roughly 500 pounds.

Long story short the Mustang will not get a newly invented setup. It’s either getting a slightly modified version of what is available in a high volume production car or isn’t getting anything at all.
As said even on the Ford Fiesta it pays off and I assume it is nothing spectcular in engineering. I think if we want a remarkable power difference to ICE, we need to wait until Ford unveils V8 hybrids, but I am biased on whether this will be really available.
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