GTD Weight Revealed

[9secondko]

You are sooo sensitive.

I had to point out the obvious to you about the GTD being limited because that has consequences which you completely overlooked. You really should proofread your remarks.

Dude you really need to stop spreading the FAKE NEWS. The ZR1 does 0-60 in 2.3, the Plaid 1.99. The ZR1 does the quarter in 9.6 the Plaid 9.23. The ONLY thing the ZR1 does better than the Plaid is in top speed. But then again, who's buying a ZR1 just to run it on the tarmac!

You can't afford the GTD and therefore you wine about it like a liberal loon. The GTD is JUST getting started while the GT3 has had years to be perfected. Its primary goal was sub 7 on the Nürburgring... check. The first for a domestic brand which is HUGE. Its secondary goal is the GT3 which it is well on its way of doing. It hasn't failed anything, but you have failed to see that.

The only goal you have hit is that of a pseudo sophisticate.

Last I checked the GTD was being marketed as a Ford product, not Multimatic and unlike you they have not given up on its vision. Time to go peddle your ZR1 elsewhere.

The Mustang II was a great car and one of the best selling generations in Mustang history. Unfortunately, performance was crippled by the politically influenced economy of the time. And contrary to popular belief it was not purely built on the Pinto platform. It evolved to be something much more than that. But I digress.

Lol. Pot, meet kettle.

You completely DCT like the track isn’t a thing.

We are on the GTD thread. The Gtd isn’t going to scare any of the big boys with its straight line prowess. So that’s the context of comparing it to the zr1, which has already destroyed the records of every track it’s been to. Every. Single. One. The Gtd has been to one track and Ford had to settle for “yay! Barely Sub-7! Whoa hoo…”

The plaid is a bit faster in a straight line due to AWD and the inherent instant torque of ev. But it will get humiliated on the track next to the zr1.

So it’s not misinformation. It’s fact. Look it up. Don’t mislead people just because you don’t like how things are.

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[9secondko]

see, you know whats funny about that, i took a look at the original Ford press release for the GTD. you know whats on there? a sub 7 minute nurb lap. you know whats not? the GT3RS

web archive link to avoid potential edits they may have done later on:
https://web.archive.org/web/2023081...n/news/2023/08/17/First-Ever-Mustang-GTD.html

And you know there were lots in interviews where the cat got let out of the bag - it was always the goal to beat the gt3rs, even going so far as to state confidence in beating the gt3, but acknowledging the gt2 was a bridge too far and that the amg one would be untouchable for them. . Sun 7 was just a safe sub goal that they knew they’d meet.

Still think they need a different driver. I don’t know if Muller has it in his heart to push the car to its limits.

 

[robvas]

The plaid is a bit faster in a straight line due to AWD and the inherent instant torque of ev. But it will get humiliated on the track next to the zr1.

Humiliated by 18 seconds, to be exact. And that wasn't even a stock Plaid.

• A modified 2022 Tesla Model S Plaid just lapped the Grand Course at Virginia International Raceway (VIR) in 2:50.7.
• That's 4.5 seconds quicker than we recorded with a production Porsche Taycan Turbo S at our 2021 Lightning Lap.

 

[agreywolfe]

And you know there were lots in interviews where the cat got let out of the bag - it was always the goal to beat the gt3rs, even going so far as to state confidence in beating the gt3, but acknowledging the gt2 was a bridge too far and that the amg one would be untouchable for them. . Sun 7 was just a safe sub goal that they knew they’d meet.

Still think they need a different driver. I don’t know if Muller has it in his heart to push the car to its limits.

I didn't say they never mentioned the GT3rs as a competitor ever. I said the official Ford announcement had the sub 7 nurb time. Which means the sub 7 nurb time has been a goal since the beginning and even before the gt3rs target. To say it was "added later on once the gt3rs target wasn't achievable" is seriously underselling the car. The GT3RS target was added because the sub 7 nurb time was almost certain.

 

[MaddNomad]

I didn't say they never mentioned the GT3rs as a competitor ever. I said the official Ford announcement had the sub 7 nurb time. Which means the sub 7 nurb time has been a goal since the beginning and even before the gt3rs target. To say it was "added later on once the gt3rs target wasn't achievable" is seriously underselling the car. The GT3RS target was added because the sub 7 nurb time was almost certain.

To clarify, when you say GT3RS target do you mean the ring time or the car in general?

 

[agreywolfe]

To clarify, when you say GT3RS target do you mean the ring time or the car in general?

Car in general, the ring time was specifically the sub 7 minute

 

[MaddNomad]

Car in general, the ring time was specifically the sub 7 minute

Well if it’s the car in general you would be wrong, because the point of the GTD per Farley was to create a Mustang version of the GT3RS, that was before the sub 7 target. He said it was in his head for decades.

Now if you said the GT3RS’s ring time, that is true, they never said they were trying to go for the GT3RS time, they said sub 7.

9secondko’s argument is beating the GT3RS time was implied when the car was built to be a Mustang GT3RS, and Farley said he wants to beat europe.

But at the end of the day who cares technically you’re both right. It’s a Mustang GT3RS (maxed out s550/650 chassis) and is supposed to compete on track, but Ford never said it was going to beat their ring time. Now let’s stop fighting. Lol

 

[9secondko]

I didn't say they never mentioned the GT3rs as a competitor ever. I said the official Ford announcement had the sub 7 nurb time. Which means the sub 7 nurb time has been a goal since the beginning and even before the gt3rs target. To say it was "added later on once the gt3rs target wasn't achievable" is seriously underselling the car. The GT3RS target was added because the sub 7 nurb time was almost certain.

Of course. Bevause it was the SAFE thing to say. But the more revealing info came from interviews, etc.

It was the stated purpose of the car to beat the gt3rs. They knew they’d meet gt2 would be too much, but really gunned for the gt3. And failed.

They simply didn’t do enough with the Gtd. End of.

They COULD have. But they didn’t.

I suspected it was in trouble when the d Ed mine figures came out. There was no way the s650 was going to do what they said when it barely made more than the old gt500 and weight was s question mark.

At that price, it really should have gone twin turbo or had an electric hybrid setup. When it came out it was basically the gt500 drivetrain but either way a transaxle, the doubt set in as it appeared ford was doing the minimum again. I know, sounds crazy. How is the Gtd minimal? I mean for a supercar effort it was minimal. Contrast thst with the old GT and the new GT. They created a bespoke platform for the thing for crying out loud. For a niche, limited production supercar. But for the Gtd? Meh. Just slap a gt500 drivetrain and have multimatic bolt in a suspension and bodykit to an s650 mustang. Oh. Add tires snd brakes for good measure. Then call it a race car that’s been declared street legal.

Hardly apples to apples.

I guess perhaps Farley wanted a truly great Gtd, but wasn’t strong enough in the boardroom.

It’s still cool to see it so it’s thing. But not at all what ford set up the expectations to be.

And if ford just wanted to do sun 7, they wouldn’t be going back this year to try to do better.

 

[agreywolfe]

Of course. Bevause it was the SAFE thing to say. But the more revealing info came from interviews, etc.

It was the stated purpose of the car to beat the gt3rs. They knew they’d meet gt2 would be too much, but really gunned for the gt3. And failed.

They simply didn’t do enough with the Gtd. End of.

They COULD have. But they didn’t.

I suspected it was in trouble when the d Ed mine figures came out. There was no way the s650 was going to do what they said when it barely made more than the old gt500 and weight was s question mark.

At that price, it really should have gone twin turbo or had an electric hybrid setup. When it came out it was basically the gt500 drivetrain but either way a transaxle, the doubt set in as it appeared ford was doing the minimum again. I know, sounds crazy. How is the Gtd minimal? I mean for a supercar effort it was minimal. Contrast thst with the old GT and the new GT. They created a bespoke platform for the thing for crying out loud. For a niche, limited production supercar. But for the Gtd? Meh. Just slap a gt500 drivetrain and have multimatic bolt in a suspension and bodykit to an s650 mustang. Oh. Add tires snd brakes for good measure. Then call it a race car that’s been declared street legal.

Hardly apples to apples.

I guess perhaps Farley wanted a truly great Gtd, but wasn’t strong enough in the boardroom.

It’s still cool to see it so it’s thing. But not at all what ford set up the expectations to be.

And if ford just wanted to do sun 7, they wouldn’t be going back this year to try to do better.

ah right, instantly selling out of all available allocations is "the doubt setting in"

i really want to see this thing at lightning lap so we can actually compare it to the rest of the Ford fleet, because right now all we can see is that its on par with the 918 Spyder at nords, which is on par with the Ford GT at lightning lap.

"they wouldnt be going back this year to try and do better"
screams to me like you live by the motto "just ok is good enough for me"
they're going back because they know they can do better, they have achieved their goal at a sub 7, but why stop there when you know you have more juice in the tank, especially when you have the ZR1 lining up for their own shot this year as well.

 

[robvas]

Can't wait for this car to finally hit the streets so the Magazines and YouTubers can test it out in the real world and make comparison videos...

 

[MaddNomad]

Can't wait for this car to finally hit the streets so the Magazines and YouTubers can test it out in the real world and make comparison videos...

Agreed.

 

[agreywolfe]

Can't wait for this car to finally hit the streets so the Magazines and YouTubers can test it out in the real world and make comparison videos...

im interested in seeing Shmee get his GTD, he says his GT is one of his favorite cars so itll be an interesting comparison

 

[9secondko]

ah right, instantly selling out of all available allocations is "the doubt setting in"

i really want to see this thing at lightning lap so we can actually compare it to the rest of the Ford fleet, because right now all we can see is that its on par with the 918 Spyder at nords, which is on par with the Ford GT at lightning lap.

"they wouldnt be going back this year to try and do better"
screams to me like you live by the motto "just ok is good enough for me"
they're going back because they know they can do better, they have achieved their goal at a sub 7, but why stop there when you know you have more juice in the tank, especially when you have the ZR1 lining up for their own shot this year as well.

No one ever said it wouldn’t sell out of the paltry amount of cars made.

The doubt setting in was about the car being what Ford and multimatic said it would be.

To be fair, we probably would be ok with the Gtd to a certain degree if there was no such thing as the zr1.

But the zr1 exists and proves Ford just didn’t do enough.

If Ford would have really went for it with the engine, that itself would have done wonders. But even better if they took the actual race car and did just enough to make it street legal, as they implied, rather than bolting a suspension up to the standard s650 mounting points, handicapping the capabilities.

The Gtd is a Cool car. If I was spoiled rich, I’d buy it. But I’d still wish ford would pushed a bit more.

But between this car and the zr1, I’d get the zr1. And I’m not a vette guy at all. If they were both equal in performance, I’d go for the Gtd all day every day. But they’re not. There is a vast delta between them. And then the price delta just makes it more concrete.

The ford GT, supercar that it is, is aging. It’s pretty much a guarantee the Gtd will beat it in some tracks if not all. But that’s not saying a whole lot. I don’t remember the GT competing with the world’s best at the Nurburgring.

So I have no interest in seeing the Gtd fight a car that isn’t even thst impressive in the track compared to the cars the Gtd was supposed to beat. That’s like settling for the consolation prize. “Oh we lost to the really tough guy we challenged, so we’ll pretend to be exited about beating up this other guy over here that we know we can beat and call that ‘winning.’”

Gtd = really cool Mustang that didn’t quite live up to the hype. Or the expense.

Every generation when Ford thinks they are safe with no competition, they do the minimal. It’s a historical trend. It always takes getting its butt kicked by Chevy, etc. to motivate them to produce something epic.

When the f body Camaros launched in 93 and on, they tore the jellybean fox 4 a new one. Even the regular z28 was spanking the expensive cobra. Then ford finally decided to go big a decade later with the terminator. But the Camaro died. So ford has no motivation to push it anymore. The s-96 came out with its continued anemic v8 and sloppy suspension and waddled on for 5 years, but with a powerful, heavy, and expensive gt500 as an option. Sadly the gt500 wasn’t as fast as its power suggested bevause it was heavy and didn’t have enough tire.

Thankfully, Chevy came back with a high horsepower (but fat) Camaro and Ford got excited again, swinging back with a powerful GT, pushing it with the Boss 302, etc. and when Chevy came out with the zl1 thst clearly exceeded Fords known gt500, ford responded with a secret weapon - a new gt500 with a 5.8 liter engine that produced nearly 100 more horses than the zl1. All of this in just a couple years time. Ford laid the smack down.

But ford, while they were ahead, got comfortable, kept the platform, and came out with a heavier mustang that didn’t do much in terms of power or handling.

Soon enough, Chevy launched the lightweight, higher horsepower Camaro with better handling. It took a much more expensive gt350 to keep up with the base SS. But this motivated for to keep pushing. The GT got better, the gt350 got better, and then the zl1 came out unchallenged. It was a monster. There wasn’t a mustang that could handle it. 3 years later, Ford launched the 2020 gt500, likely the most impressive mustang they’ve ever produced. And it stomped the zl1. It accelerated, it handled, it was all around everything you could want. Then the Camaro died again.

And then we had an s650 come out, using the same old/old platform yet again with a slight hp bump for the GT and a dark horse mustang as its best option. This is actually a better try than tje s197 era that launch with basically zero upgrades and very poor power. But it’s not anything groundbreaking. A Gtd experiment was welcome, but once again, without any known competition from Chevy or dodge, Ford was left doing just enough.

Meanwhile GM was pushing it until their skin came off, ensuring their secret weapon would be the stuff of legends.

So while the Gtd is a bit of a bummer in the sense that it’s a crazy expensive gt500, I think the existence of the zr1 will compel ford to do something wild with the next Cobra.


And at the very least, someone’s got to be paying attention enough to realize they can keep using the same old rickety platform anymore. It’s time to swing for the fences from the ground up.

 

[drive_55_not]

No one ever said it wouldn’t sell out of the paltry amount of cars made.

The doubt setting in was about the car being what Ford and multimatic said it would be.

To be fair, we probably would be ok with the Gtd to a certain degree if there was no such thing as the zr1.

But the zr1 exists and proves Ford just didn’t do enough.

If Ford would have really went for it with the engine, that itself would have done wonders. But even better if they took the actual race car and did just enough to make it street legal, as they implied, rather than bolting a suspension up to the standard s650 mounting points, handicapping the capabilities.

The Gtd is a Cool car. If I was spoiled rich, I’d buy it. But I’d still wish ford would pushed a bit more.

But between this car and the zr1, I’d get the zr1. And I’m not a vette guy at all. If they were both equal in performance, I’d go for the Gtd all day every day. But they’re not. There is a vast delta between them. And then the price delta just makes it more concrete.

The ford GT, supercar that it is, is aging. It’s pretty much a guarantee the Gtd will beat it in some tracks if not all. But that’s not saying a whole lot. I don’t remember the GT competing with the world’s best at the Nurburgring.

So I have no interest in seeing the Gtd fight a car that isn’t even thst impressive in the track compared to the cars the Gtd was supposed to beat. That’s like settling for the consolation prize. “Oh we lost to the really tough guy we challenged, so we’ll pretend to be exited about beating up this other guy over here that we know we can beat and call that ‘winning.’”

Gtd = really cool Mustang that didn’t quite live up to the hype. Or the expense.

Every generation when Ford thinks they are safe with no competition, they do the minimal. It’s a historical trend. It always takes getting its butt kicked by Chevy, etc. to motivate them to produce something epic.

When the f body Camaros launched in 93 and on, they tore the jellybean fox 4 a new one. Even the regular z28 was spanking the expensive cobra. Then ford finally decided to go big a decade later with the terminator. But the Camaro died. So ford has no motivation to push it anymore. The s-96 came out with its continued anemic v8 and sloppy suspension and waddled on for 5 years, but with a powerful, heavy, and expensive gt500 as an option. Sadly the gt500 wasn’t as fast as its power suggested bevause it was heavy and didn’t have enough tire.

Thankfully, Chevy came back with a high horsepower (but fat) Camaro and Ford got excited again, swinging back with a powerful GT, pushing it with the Boss 302, etc. and when Chevy came out with the zl1 thst clearly exceeded Fords known gt500, ford responded with a secret weapon - a new gt500 with a 5.8 liter engine that produced nearly 100 more horses than the zl1. All of this in just a couple years time. Ford laid the smack down.

But ford, while they were ahead, got comfortable, kept the platform, and came out with a heavier mustang that didn’t do much in terms of power or handling.

Soon enough, Chevy launched the lightweight, higher horsepower Camaro with better handling. It took a much more expensive gt350 to keep up with the base SS. But this motivated for to keep pushing. The GT got better, the gt350 got better, and then the zl1 came out unchallenged. It was a monster. There wasn’t a mustang that could handle it. 3 years later, Ford launched the 2020 gt500, likely the most impressive mustang they’ve ever produced. And it stomped the zl1. It accelerated, it handled, it was all around everything you could want. Then the Camaro died again.

And then we had an s650 come out, using the same old/old platform yet again with a slight hp bump for the GT and a dark horse mustang as its best option. This is actually a better try than tje s197 era that launch with basically zero upgrades and very poor power. But it’s not anything groundbreaking. A Gtd experiment was welcome, but once again, without any known competition from Chevy or dodge, Ford was left doing just enough.

Meanwhile GM was pushing it until their skin came off, ensuring their secret weapon would be the stuff of legends.

So while the Gtd is a bit of a bummer in the sense that it’s a crazy expensive gt500, I think the existence of the zr1 will compel ford to do something wild with the next Cobra.


And at the very least, someone’s got to be paying attention enough to realize they can keep using the same old rickety platform anymore. It’s time to swing for the fences from the ground up.

I told myself I would ignor this thread but, Seriously,

10pages long and 1/2 are you complaining ... Give it a rest already.

The S650 and whatever facelifts it'll get, will run til 2029 so either buy one or don't ...



./

 

[Cauf E. Bean]

Let’s don’t get our collective shorts too bunched up just yet. There has to be a mistake somewhere.

Just no way 4343 could be correct.

Especially when the 2024 Mustang GT Premiums weigh in at 3832 with an automatic trans. I don't see how they'd have added 500 pounds on accident.

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