26GT got boost - not ESS/Whipple/Procharger *Roush 2650 Phase2 810hp*

[Junkyard Dog]

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[ZXMustang]

So I tried and tired and tried all the tuning magic I could come up with for low side pump pressure droop. Short of disabling all the low fuel pressure air reduction in the PCM, I just havent been able to solve this tuning only. I decided to just get the VMP fuel pump booster box and see what happens.

Just the same in the whipple cal, I can see Roush trying to command 18v out of the pump at 12lb/hr of fuel mass. And sitting at 8, Im only getting 14ish out of the pump. When I try to rescale the table to move the fuel mass closer to the 18v cells, I get the logged voltage saying its getting 18v, but its still doing the exact droop, closing the throttle in the process. So lets see if this BAP from VMP which is completely plug and play can work.

If it does then my base recommendation even for 93 on 10-12psi would be GT500 injectors and one of these boosters. I was on e30 for a minute and that made things exponentially worse. Its a shame too since these kits are proving to be quite potent. I put a car 40-140 on a local customer I have with a stage 1 whipple. He was same as me completely stock, on the stage 1 whipple tune. I just walked away effortlessly. I was also in the middle of the throtte closing almost 15% from 7k in ever gear to the 7800rpm shift points. I can only imagine what its going to do when the throttle stays open and it stays on the boil for the entire pass. This car is a rocketship.

Also this was almost the exact same scenario I see with the ESS cars as well with the GT500 injectors, 120pulley on 93. They start low side drooping and throttle closing. And I wont defeat the OEM safeties to get a number. Not worth it with boost.

 

[ZXMustang]

And correction on the boost. Its 12.1 PSI Im seeing with the 810hp Phase 2 kit pulley. Not 14psi.

 

[needforspeedirl]

So I tried and tired and tried all the tuning magic I could come up with for low side pump pressure droop. Short of disabling all the low fuel pressure air reduction in the PCM, I just havent been able to solve this tuning only. I decided to just get the VMP fuel pump booster box and see what happens.

Just the same in the whipple cal, I can see Roush trying to command 18v out of the pump at 12lb/hr of fuel mass. And sitting at 8, Im only getting 14ish out of the pump. When I try to rescale the table to move the fuel mass closer to the 18v cells, I get the logged voltage saying its getting 18v, but its still doing the exact droop, closing the throttle in the process. So lets see if this BAP from VMP which is completely plug and play can work.

If it does then my base recommendation even for 93 on 10-12psi would be GT500 injectors and one of these boosters. I was on e30 for a minute and that made things exponentially worse. Its a shame too since these kits are proving to be quite potent. I put a car 40-140 on a local customer I have with a stage 1 whipple. He was same as me completely stock, on the stage 1 whipple tune. I just walked away effortlessly. I was also in the middle of the throtte closing almost 15% from 7k in ever gear to the 7800rpm shift points. I can only imagine what its going to do when the throttle stays open and it stays on the boil for the entire pass. This car is a rocketship.

Also this was almost the exact same scenario I see with the ESS cars as well with the GT500 injectors, 120pulley on 93. They start low side drooping and throttle closing. And I wont defeat the OEM safeties to get a number. Not worth it with boost.

I skipped the BAP all together and just put the KPM 1500 kit on. It’s $3600 but I won’t ever have to worry about the pump going out due to heat or the voltage dropping for one reason or another. It’s also plug and play. I’m running full e85 on it and putting down consistent 5.5 second 60-130.

 

[ZXMustang]

Thats interesting. Looks like they have a plug and play 1000hp kit. I will have to look into that. If I keep this car long term I would do it up right, but for me most of these have just been tuning developement vehicles.

And for this one specifically, the roush kit has been severely slept on because of the previous gen blowers that were very poorly designed. These new ones are all TVS2650R but in the newest magnusson cases with the massive cooling bricks. They are very efficient and once tuned properly, they easily run with whipple 3.0s even being only 2.65L. Plus they scream like crazy which everyone wants.

 

[robvas]

Thats interesting. Looks like they have a plug and play 1000hp kit. I will have to look into that. If I keep this car long term I would do it up right, but for me most of these have just been tuning developement vehicles.

But that's 1000hp crank on 93...do you think you will have any headroom to run even E30/E50 on that and still make 900+ whp?

And for this one specifically, the roush kit has been severely slept on because of the previous gen blowers that were very poorly designed. These new ones are all TVS2650R but in the newest magnusson cases with the massive cooling bricks. They are very efficient and once tuned properly, they easily run with whipple 3.0s even being only 2.65L. Plus they scream like crazy which everyone wants.

There's the famous 2650 vs Whipple 3.0 back from when the Whipple gen 5 first came out....

 

[needforspeedirl]

But that's 1000hp crank on 93...do you think you will have any headroom to run even E30/E50 on that and still make 900+ whp?

There's the famous 2650 vs Whipple 3.0 back from when the Whipple gen 5 first came out....

As far as the fuel system goes the KPM 1500 kit is as small as I would go while running ethanol blends. They have bigger kits if you’re chasing 1000+ whp on e85.

 

[ZXMustang]

But that's 1000hp crank on 93...do you think you will have any headroom to run even E30/E50 on that and still make 900+ whp?

There's the famous 2650 vs Whipple 3.0 back from when the Whipple gen 5 first came out....

That’s because of the ultra conservative roush tune. The hardware is 1:1 I assure you. And seeing both cals first hand and knowing how much roush left on the table, it’s no wonder they are behind. Fueling alone they got this tune going 9.0 rich on you at wide open throttle.
There is a laundry list of things between the cals that’s vastly different and roush took the conservative path under whipple.

 

[robvas]

Neither of those are stock tunes...

 

[Junkyard Dog]

But that's 1000hp crank on 93...do you think you will have any headroom to run even E30/E50 on that and still make 900+ whp?

There's the famous 2650 vs Whipple 3.0 back from when the Whipple gen 5 first came out....

As far as the fuel system goes the KPM 1500 kit is as small as I would go while running ethanol blends. They have bigger kits if you’re chasing 1000+ whp on e85.

KPM has a chart for gasoline and E85 and forced induction.

Basically an E85 car with forced induction that is 1000 hp needs a step up in the kit.

The ratings are for naturally aspirated on gasoline.

I bet you could inquire directly with them about your fuel and psi and horsepower and get a recommendation.

The 800 hp pumps cure the left hand turn fuel starvation issue caused by the saddle tank design in Mustangs.


Ah, stop guessing. Found it:

 

[ZXMustang]

Thanks JD, that helps. At this point I might just try 93/Octane booster over E85. See how far that will go. Save some fuel system volume. Im thinking in terms of a tuning customer that buys a whipple or roush or even ESS kit and is asking for recommendations how to make the most power per dollar.

Its looking like the VMP fuel pump booster and some 93/octane booster might get you most of the way to say 800 to the tire on a smaller pulley. The GT500 injectors everyone sells with their kits are alright, but I always recommend the ID1050x or FIC1000s to cover it. But 800 to the tire for a street car for most of these kids buying the ESS kits for their cars with Affirm, is probably a pretty decent set up for the money...

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