Ford Says It Makes 500 hp, Four Different Dynos Give Four Different Results

[Junkyard Dog]

If advertised as a 500hp car it should perform as such but in reality it's a 425ish HP car and gets beaten by cars that are comparable on paper.

Could you please tell me a little more about why you say these things?

500 hp is the Dark Horse. With proper traction, it performs as a 500 horsepower car would at that car weight. With slicks, it generally runs 11.8 - 12.2, depending on conditions at the track.

The 486 horsepower GT does, as well.

With stock OEM tires and no traction, on a non-optimum weather day, plenty of these cars are knocking down e.t. in the low 12s. See here:

https://www.mustang7g.com/forums/threads/2024-gt-vs-2024-dark-horse-1-4-mile-drag-strip-race.158559/

I would be interested in hearing why you do not believe that is so.

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[robvas]

Could you please tell me a little more about why you say these things?

I would be interested in hearing why you do not believe that is so.

Probably because 500hp BMW's have been tested in the 1/4 mile and they are significantly faster than the DH

503-hp twin-turbo 3.0-liter inline-six. the quarter-mile passes in 11.0 seconds at 124 mph

When you stick them on the dyno though, you can see the BMW is underrated

 

[ChitownStang]

Not really, but most believe that they underrate their horsepower figures. Whether that is true, I do not know, but nobody is going to sue BMW for fraud if they discover the car has more horsepower than advertised.

Very true.
Example, an M2 with less HP pulls hard on a Mustang in many videos
Also I’ve seen it dyno’s at advertised HP

 

[Dave2013M3]

Not really, but most believe that they underrate their horsepower figures. Whether that is true, I do not know, but nobody is going to sue BMW for fraud if they discover the car has more horsepower than advertised.

Very true.
Example, an M2 with less HP pulls hard on a Mustang in many videos
Also I’ve seen it dyno’s at advertised HP

Probably because 500hp BMW's have been tested in the 1/4 mile and they are significantly faster than the DH

503-hp twin-turbo 3.0-liter inline-six. the quarter-mile passes in 11.0 seconds at 124 mph

When you stick them on the dyno though, you can see the BMW is underrated

My G87 completely stock with only 5k miles on her ran 456.3rwp SAE and 409rwtq on a Dynojet. Granted I was running an E25 blend with the stock tune which put me at 94 octane. For a car that is rated at 453hp I would definitely say BMW is underrating their hp.

Not to mention a manual G87s runs 120mph in the 1/4mile while GTs are running 113-114mph and DHs are running 115mph.

I don't have proof, but I wonder if the G8X cars have a turbo overboost in 3rd gear...as it just hauls the mail in this gear.

As far as the 11.0 the best, I have seen in the magazines was the CS running [email protected] is smoking in these little cars. Now there is an Xdrive of the M2 coming out....look out.

One other thing and I will get off my M2 highhorse. The manual M2 is really torque managed. Traction even on the pre LCI (453 vs.473 for LCI) is traction limited. This car can be shifted aggressively, it doesn't like to be power shifted. One of the reasons the 8spd auto is so much quicker.

That all being said, I find myself missing a Mustang. At low speeds the M2 really isn't that much fun. To start having fun in these cars you have to start driving like a hooligan. I loved my S550 even at low speed. The grumble and noises coming out of that sweet Coyote...it was a pleasure to drive both slow and fast. I added a 4" single midpipe and have an exhaust valve controller on the M2 to give me some low rpm sound, but its still no match to the visceral feel of the Mustang. Its just the M2 does everything so well, it would make it hard to switch back. My next step is adding the CS software to the car, which is OEM BMW software and it wont raise the torque but it will get you darn near 500rwhp.

 

[135Hoser]

Probably because 500hp BMW's have been tested in the 1/4 mile and they are significantly faster than the DH

503-hp twin-turbo 3.0-liter inline-six. the quarter-mile passes in 11.0 seconds at 124 mph

When you stick them on the dyno though, you can see the BMW is underrated

C&d had it at 11.7 in the quarter mile at 120. This is far more plausible for a stock m2.

Very true.
Example, an M2 with less HP pulls hard on a Mustang in many videos
Also I’ve seen it dyno’s at advertised HP

If it has less hp but weighs the same how is it pulling on the mustang?

The advertised hp for all cars conforms to a standard and is at the crank. This is not hard to understand. Some makers will have their cars output more than advertised. Why can’t people grasp this. Japan for decades had a gentlemen’s agreement on advertised power output numbers for their sports cars and some put out a lot more.

Also dynos can be manipulated to give you whatever numbers you want.

Hp/tq is largely irrelevant and a quarter mile time and trap speed are a far better measure of a vehicles capability to go fast either by traction, raw power, or both.

 

[robvas]

C&d had it at 11.7 in the quarter mile at 120. This is far more plausible for a stock m2.

The CS (520 vs 473hp) is the one that went 125

 

[ChitownStang]

C&d had it at 11.7 in the quarter mile at 120. This is far more plausible for a stock m2.



If it has less hp but weighs the same how is it pulling on the mustang?

The advertised hp for all cars conforms to a standard and is at the crank. This is not hard to understand. Some makers will have their cars output more than advertised. Why can’t people grasp this. Japan for decades had a gentlemen’s agreement on advertised power output numbers for their sports cars and some put out a lot more.

Also dynos can be manipulated to give you whatever numbers you want.

Hp/tq is largely irrelevant and a quarter mile time and trap speed are a far better measure of a vehicles capability to go fast either by traction, raw power, or both.

Because it has more HP going to the wheels.
Watch any video online M2 vs mustang, Mustang loses every time.
I cross shopped them , and almost went with the M2 but I didn’t like the shifter and I didn’t like the exhaust. 2 of the most important things. Looks went to the Dark Horse as well.
There will always be a faster car.
My Flex tune and other rolling weight reduction mods probably make me close to a stock M2 now though

 

[Junkyard Dog]

Probably because 500hp BMW's have been tested in the 1/4 mile and they are significantly faster than the DH

503-hp twin-turbo 3.0-liter inline-six. the quarter-mile passes in 11.0 seconds at 124 mph

When you stick them on the dyno though, you can see the BMW is underrated

I see italics, like you are quoting something. What is your source? Which car? What does it weigh?

 

[Junkyard Dog]

Dark Horse 3992 lbs with automatic
M2 CS 3770 lbs

And it is 523 horsepower, so I do not even know if this is the car you are mentioning.

It does have 61 lb ft of torque advantage over the Dark Horse in addition to the horsepower and weight advantages. This is why it does not come with a manual transmission. The torque would break the tranny, so they would have to tune the torque limits way down.

 

[robvas]

Dark Horse 3992 lbs with automatic
M2 CS 3770 lbs

And it is 523 horsepower, so I do not even know if this is the car you are mentioning.

It does have 61 lb ft of torque advantage over the Dark Horse in addition to the horsepower and weight advantages. This is why it does not come with a manual transmission. The torque would break the tranny, so they would have to tune the torque limits way down.

503hp
Curb Weight: 3929 lb
8 speed automatic

https://www.caranddriver.com/review...ition-xdrive-edition-50-jahre-by-the-numbers/

 

[Junkyard Dog]

503hp
Curb Weight: 3929 lb
8 speed automatic

https://www.caranddriver.com/review...ition-xdrive-edition-50-jahre-by-the-numbers/

Thanks.

To make it fair we must turbo the Coyote with 15 psi, too.

 

[Junkyard Dog]

That's a nice car at a better than expected price. EDIT, well, not the as tested price.

Launch control, something I wish the Mustang had. AWD, another great advantage. No wonder it has a 1 second 0-30 and a 2.8 0-60.

As the article notes, these traction advantages make up 0.7 seconds in the quarter mile over the rear wheel drive model even with 150 pounds added.

 

[Ninjak]

503hp
Curb Weight: 3929 lb
8 speed automatic

https://www.caranddriver.com/review...ition-xdrive-edition-50-jahre-by-the-numbers/

The article link is for an M3 xDrive, an AWD vehicle. AWD vehicles will always be faster down the track than ANY RWD vehicle with equal power. Unless the RWD is set up for drag racing, it is going to be some tough sledding to get by an AWD car with an automatic.

This is why GTR's dominated for so long on the streets from a dig and at the track. AWD, good power = coming off the line with great 60ft. That will win most races against any stock-to-stock car.

 

[robvas]

The article link is for an M3 xDrive, an AWD vehicle. AWD vehicles will always be faster down the track than ANY RWD vehicle with equal power. Unless the RWD is set up for drag racing, it is going to be some tough sledding to get by an AWD car with an automatic.

This is why GTR's dominated for so long on the streets from a dig and at the track. AWD, good power = coming off the line with great 60ft. That will win most races against any stock-to-stock car.

But, we're talking about horsepower which correlates to trap speeds and AWD is a hindrance in that

 

[Junkyard Dog]

But, we're talking about horsepower which correlates to trap speeds and AWD is a hindrance in that

Google says 685 horsepower to the flywheel to hit 124 mph.

503 advertised is a big difference. That's not even advertising the wheel horsepower (584).

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