Michelin PS4S Cracked and Ruined!

[COBill]

Please, for your own safety and pocket, don't keep these on through the winter.

Great story from my local Porsche dealer:

Had a customer who insisted on picking up his new 911 with summer tires at night when it came in in January.

The roads were clean with no snow, and he said he knew all about summer tires and would be careful.

The sales manager watched him pull out, turn out of the driveway and then slide sideways into a curb across the street.

Road was dry but ambient temperature the car had been sitting in was about 19ºF.

Did about $8000 in damage.

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[BimmerDriver]

PS4S stands for Pilot Sport 4S.

Do you drive on them? If so, have you experienced cracking as a result of cold temperatures?

I have driven on them over several winters and have experienced nothing of that sort, in spite of all the online speculation and hand wringing.

What about you? Have you driven them in cold weather, below 7° Celsius (about 45° Fahrenheit)? What happened?

I've had them on multiple cars, drove in winter with no issues, no cracking, or anything else. I'm not in Wisonsin, but I am in NC and I remember one cold day driving to the track in my M2 with PS4S at a mere 14 degrees. Farenheit, or fahrenheit (my spell checker isn't working). The cold tires on a cold track never do well, even snow tires wouldn't do well, but these did remarkably well.

Pirelllis, not so much.

You'll be fine.

 

[Junkyard Dog]

I am in NC and I remember one cold day driving to the track in my M2 with PS4S at a mere 14 degrees. Farenheit, or fahrenheit (my spell checker isn't working). The cold tires on a cold track never do well, even snow tires wouldn't do well, but these did remarkably well.

Just curious, did they ever get hot at the track or was the asphalt temperature and ambient temperature too much to overcome in a half hour session or subsequent sessions?

Does anybody know: Is there some specific tire formula that professional racing teams use if there is a cold snap during a scheduled race? Or do they just hit the track and wait for the tires to heat up before pushing hard?

 

[Cz_Ziemniak]

Great story from my local Porsche dealer:

Had a customer who insisted on picking up his new 911 with summer tires at night when it came in in January.

The roads were clean with no snow, and he said he knew all about summer tires and would be careful.

The sales manager watched him pull out, turn out of the driveway and then slide sideways into a curb across the street.

Road was dry but ambient temperature the car had been sitting in was about 19ºF.

Did about $8000 in damage.

Either there was ice on the road, or he floored it and went into the curb.

The tires wont just magically start sliding. I've driven plenty of summer tires in sub zero temperatures.

 

[COBill]

Dry, no black ice.

In cold temperatures, summer rubber is so hard it has near zero lateral grip.

 

[Cz_Ziemniak]

Dry, no black ice.

In cold temperatures, summer rubber is so hard it has near zero lateral grip.

Then he floored it and went sliding.

Again, the tires wont just magically slide into a curb.

 

[robvas]

Great story from my local Porsche dealer:

Had a customer who insisted on picking up his new 911 with summer tires at night when it came in in January.

The roads were clean with no snow, and he said he knew all about summer tires and would be careful.

The sales manager watched him pull out, turn out of the driveway and then slide sideways into a curb across the street.

Road was dry but ambient temperature the car had been sitting in was about 19ºF.

Did about $8000 in damage.

So he just scratched the wheels on one side?

 

[robvas]

Just curious, did they ever get hot at the track or was the asphalt temperature and ambient temperature too much to overcome in a half hour session or subsequent sessions?

Does anybody know: Is there some specific tire formula that professional racing teams use if there is a cold snap during a scheduled race? Or do they just hit the track and wait for the tires to heat up before pushing hard?

https://www.motorsportmagazine.com/...e-in-the-cold-las-vegas-grand-prix-challenge/

 

[Junkyard Dog]

Then he floored it and went sliding.

Again, the tires wont just magically slide into a curb.

It does not mean he floored it. He exceeded the grip that the tires had. On my Pirelli Trofeo RS tires in 40 degree weather, it does not take much to get them to slide.

I have not had this experience with PS4S in the winter, but I had them on an AWD German sedan, not a Mustang.

 

[Cz_Ziemniak]

It does not mean he floored it. He exceeded the grip that the tires had. On my Pirelli Trofeo RS tires in 40 degree weather, it does not take much to get them to slide.

I have not had this experience with PS4S in the winter, but I had them on an AWD German sedan, not a Mustang.

He said "The sales manager watched him pull out, turn out of the driveway and then slide sideways into a curb across the street."

If he was pulling out of a driveway, he could not have been going more than 10 or 15 miles an hour.

If you're exceeding lateral grip at this speed, its either ice, or you're spinning the tires.

 

[NVERL8]

I had the P zeros summers on mine until last week. I can tell you that below 40 in any wet condition it was pretty interesting. pretty easy to turn sharply and make the front understeer.

 

[COBill]

Not at all true, but I won't argue it with you.

Drive on summer tires in the cold if you like, enjoy the body shop.

 

[Cz_Ziemniak]

Not at all true, but I won't argue it with you.

Drive on summer tires in the cold if you like, enjoy the body shop.

So you're saying that turning out of a driveway at 10 mph made a car slide into a curb without any ice on completely dry pavement?

Okay

 

[COBill]

So you're saying that turning out of a driveway at 10 mph made a car slide into a curb without any ice on completely dry pavement?

Okay

Yes.

I mentioned previously, a different dealer used to do a demo where in temperatures below about 15ºF they could push a 911 parked in their lot sideways with little trouble because the summer tires were that useless in the cold.

 

[Cz_Ziemniak]

Yes.

I mentioned previously, a different dealer used to do a demo where in temperatures below about 15ºF they could push a 911 parked in their lot sideways with little trouble because the summer tires were that useless in the cold.

If you floor it, yes, it will break traction at 10 miles an hour, but it will not just slide into a curb without deliberate input. There's still friction to the pavement, it wont just slip slide at that speed.

I can push any rwd car sideways in a parking lot with any normal tires at any temperature.

If you told me he went sideways at 40 mph, or that there was ice, or it was wet, or anything else, I'd say that makes a lot of sense.

Sitting here telling me that "pulling out of a parking lot put the car into a curb on dry pavement" is nonsense.

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